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Thread: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

  1. #1
    Super Moderator Yandards's Avatar
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    Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    After spending some considerable time on Saturday working out where the timing marks are on the G60 I now feel I can categorically state just WTF is going on.

    First of all start by removing the plug from the gearbox that allows you to see the timing marks on the flywheel, you want to rotate the crank to get the mark with a small '0' above it directly under the 'V' on the gearbox housing as in Figure 1.[attachment=9:3ombw9pb]Figure 1.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb] This is a lot more accurate than using the mark on the pulley and the cam cover as the flywheel is a very precise fit onto the crank and being larger in diameter it is possible to set it to a more exact point.

    Next you will need to set up the intermediate shaft, the dot on the pulley has to sit in the 'V' cutout on the serpentine belt pulley on the crank. As once again a picture speaks a thousand words look at Figure 2.[attachment=8:3ombw9pb]Figure 2.jpg[/attachment:3ombw9pb]

    To set the distributor to No.1 TDC you will need to align the centre of the rotor arm with the 1mm cutout in the plastic shield (Figure 10), the picture is not great but you will need to set the timing properly with a timing light - 2000-2500 RPM 4-8 deg BTDC, there is another timing mark on the flywheel at 6 deg BTDC if you have not had a replacement flywheel fitted. There should also be a mark on the distributor housing below the cover cap cutout, although you may find there are several marks on the distributor housing. [attachment=0:3ombw9pb]Figure 10.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb]

    Finally the real bone of contention here, the camshaft pulley positioning. As I had the cam cover off to change the seal I had a good fiddle with this to double check it. First of all the mark on the cam cover side of the pulley is only accurate if you fit the cam cover seal, if you look at figure 3 you can see that the dot on the camshaft pulley is inline with the top of the cylinder head.[attachment=7:3ombw9pb]Figure 3.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb]
    However, if you then go to fit the cambelt it will not engage with the teeth on the camshaft pulley. So I then double checked the camshaft pulley position using the other method. There are 2 dots on the camshaft pulley looking at it from the airbox side, these are intended to sit either side of a mark on the rocker cover but the workshop manual is not very clear (Figure 4).[attachment=6:3ombw9pb]Figure 4.jpg[/attachment:3ombw9pb]
    With the rocker cover off and cleaned up it is quite obvious which point the manual is referring to (Figures 5 and 6).[attachment=5:3ombw9pb]Figure 5.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb][attachment=4:3ombw9pb]Figure 6.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb] I then refitted the cam cover and checked to see if the marks aligned - they dont.

    So from some deductive work I reasoned that with the cam cover seal fitted the mark on the cam cover side of the pulley is in the correct alignment (Figure 7), if you refer to the workshop manual it does not clearly show if the seal is fitted or not.[attachment=3:3ombw9pb]Figure 7.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb]
    My reasoning behind this being correct is two fold, 1st of all I know that the flywheel mark I used to set the crank to is very accurate, 2nd the 'other' set of markings on the cam pulley align properly. To check the accuracy of the camshaft pulley I inserted a small screwdriver between the cam teeth and looked to see where it located on the refitted cam cover (Figures 8 and 9).
    [attachment=2:3ombw9pb]Figure 8.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb][attachment=1:3ombw9pb]Figure 9.JPG[/attachment:3ombw9pb]

    To finish make sure you give the engine 1 or 2 full rotations by hand and then set the 0 deg mark using the flywheel marking, then re-check the camshaft pulley alignment is still ok. I know mine does not meet up perfectly at the camshaft pulley end but it is not a whole tooth out as that required too much adjustment at the flywheel end to ensure correct belt tension. The car does run well not it is not 180 degrees out - another reason to use the flywheel markings!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Cheers fool,
    Yan
    1990 G60-16v Blue Pearl Effect
    Now sold, 1991 Nugget G60
    CCGB Technical Secretary


  2. #2
    Super Moderator Supercharged's Avatar
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    Yan, sorry - didn't see this thread...

    Good to see the inside of your engine is the same colour as mine - so strange and never seen another VW like it apart from G60's

    How much backlash should there be on the intermediate shaft? - I noticed on mine if I 'wriggle' the rotor arm the pulley moves in and out by about half a mm moving the cambelt with it!

    Also what about the line on the dizzy casing - should the rotor arm point directly at this at TDC or is this a 6 degree marking?


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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    My dizzy has never been moved from the factory.
    It still had the tamper proof cover on the 13mm nut up untiol recently.

    When I set the Intermediate pulley up so that the dizzy pointed to the tdc mark it ran horribly.
    real sluggish.Must have been retarded.
    I then set it up using all the reference marks a la bentley.
    This put the rotor arm a few degrees prior to the tdc mark on the dizzy.
    The engine ran normally after I did this.
    92 G60.

    'I'd like to live like a poor man with lots of money.'
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    Super Moderator Yandards's Avatar
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtytorque
    My dizzy has never been moved from the factory.
    It still had the tamper proof cover on the 13mm nut up untiol recently.

    When I set the Intermediate pulley up so that the dizzy pointed to the tdc mark it ran horribly.
    real sluggish.Must have been retarded.
    I then set it up using all the reference marks a la bentley.
    This put the rotor arm a few degrees prior to the tdc mark on the dizzy.
    The engine ran normally after I did this.
    The dizzy mark is only there as a rough set-up guide, you really need to time the engine dynamically at 2000-2500rpm and 6 deg BTDC to get it set properly. I'll put some money that the cambelt has been done in the past though and if this is a tooth out on the intermediate shaft then it will mess up the timing.
    Cheers fool,
    Yan
    1990 G60-16v Blue Pearl Effect
    Now sold, 1991 Nugget G60
    CCGB Technical Secretary


  5. #5
    CF-oholic! Riley's Avatar
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    Nice one mate

    I put my cam back a tooth yesterday as per the above.

    Still got the problem like... and drives pretty much the same

    Neil.

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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    This is interesting.

    I installed my Shrick cam courtesy of G-werks last night.

    As my cam belt is only a few hundred miles old, I thought it would be a good idea just to slacken the tensioner and lift the belt off whist swapping the cam (marking the relevant position on the belt and pulleys beforehand).

    So before removing the belt, I rotated the engine to tdc on the flywheel I inserted a screwdriver in the pulley between the two timing dots on the outside of the pully and it did not line up with the lip on right hand side of the cam cover (the screwdriver went into the cavity in the head just beneath the cam cover).

    It was one tooth out.

    I have timed it correctly with the new cam but have yet to fire her up as I need to put it all back together.

    The question is, what would the long term effects of running a tooth out on the PG engine?
    A problem is an opportunity in disguise

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    Super Moderator Supercharged's Avatar
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    You won't have done any damage running a tooth out on the cam, lucky it wasn't a 16V tho!


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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    Thanks,

    Well,

    I've just spoken to Darren and my original cam alignment was correct.

    The lip on the outer cover is a bit misleading.

    Correct timing is when a straight edge is placed along the top of the head (no gasket in place) lining up with the inner single dot on the pulley.

    So, I'll be moving mine back a tooth before I start the engine...
    A problem is an opportunity in disguise

    92 G60 Burgundy Pearl Cream Leather - foolishly sold

    TVR Cerbera 4.5 , TVR Tuscan S

  9. #9
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    r u hapy that the intermediate pulley didn't move when you slackended and then re attached the belt ?
    Did u make a note of the position of the dizzy rotar?
    That would be my only concern doing it this way.

    ta.
    92 G60.

    'I'd like to live like a poor man with lots of money.'
    Picasso

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    Super Moderator Yandards's Avatar
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    Re: Definitive G60 Timing Belt Setting

    Quote Originally Posted by Kick Up The Rs
    Thanks,

    Well,

    I've just spoken to Darren and my original cam alignment was correct.

    The lip on the outer cover is a bit misleading.

    Correct timing is when a straight edge is placed along the top of the head (no gasket in place) lining up with the inner single dot on the pulley.

    So, I'll be moving mine back a tooth before I start the engine...
    With the flywheel set to 0 degrees by using the gearbox end did you find that the camshaft pulley aligns correct or that is half a tooth out?
    Cheers fool,
    Yan
    1990 G60-16v Blue Pearl Effect
    Now sold, 1991 Nugget G60
    CCGB Technical Secretary


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