Replaced PCV and FPR on VR6. What a difference.

[-Neil- 0]

Indeed it is.

[aclwalker 3]

Well im currently trying to sort out my running issues and got somewhere today, replaced my ISV with a known working one and my car seems to be running fine at the moment!

 

But when i accelerate i notice the car kind of ever so slightly judders as i accelerate, this may be the FPR, where do i find this to replace it?

 

Also, i looked at changing my PVC, but i DONT HAVE ONE! :s

I've got a 1993 VR6 coilpack

here are 2 pics of what i have..

 

 

i met with another CF'er and he had a 1995 VR6 with a 4 pin MAF and his PCV looked liked this...

 

can someone tell me if mine is correct or if i should have this vavle thing?

Mine looks exactly like the last picture. Note the difference in the corrugation too for the air intake? Yours is all chunky, whereas mine is like the last pic, very narrow bands.

 

I wonder if somebody has put the air intake from a newer VR6 (Golf, Sharan, etc.) onto your car. However, the newer ones (OBD-II, they seem to refer to them as) did not have the branch off to the ISV as I believe the ISV is integrated into the throttle body on post-Corrado VR6 engines. So I'm not really sure where you've got that air intake from. I suppose it could be third party.

 

To answer your question about the blanked plug, this is meant to be like that. North American Corrados have a heater element in here to prevent the vapours freezing in winter. European (or at least UK) spec Corrados never had these heaters, hence the redundant connector which is just plugged into a dummy socket.

[aclwalker 3]

The top pic is how mine is set up. Maybe its just on the late VRs... would it be worth fitting one to an early VR?

As far as I'm aware, the PCV valve (positive crankcase ventilation) is designed to stop combustion gases that leak past the cylinder rings from entering the engine on idle, but to gradually allow them as the throttle is opened . That's why there's a vacuum connection to it. As the throttle is opened, the vacuum drops and the valve opens to allow the vapours to be burned off. These vapours can be oily too, which is why the throttle body and ISV get gummed up with oily deposits over time.

 

So, if you've just got a straight hose, with no valve, then you are effectively circulating those vapours all the time, with no adjustment relative to vacuum levels in the engine. This possibly doesn't matter too much if you don't idle a lot, but I guess it's not the way it's meant to be.

 

My problem was that my PCV valve was actually leaking air from the atmosphere, which was messing around with the mixture. You won't have THAT problem (assuming your hose is not leaking) and so the metering will probably still be correct, it's just that you might be having too much of the blow by gases going in when they shouldn't be.

 

You can't buy the hoses or the valve from VW, you have to buy the whole air intake, which includes the big diameter bit and the breather stuff and PCV valve.

 

However, you can get all these bits individually from Ford. Inspect your whole system. If it's in a poor state then it would probably be cheaper to buy the whole thing from VW, but if you only need a PCV valve and the bit of hose, then it would probably be better going to Ford. Tell them you have a 1994 Galaxy VR6.

 

You may be able to get away with simply shortening your existing hose enough to accommodate the PCV valve.

 

There is one more important consideration. See the small diameter hose that goes from the block down under the main air intake and to an electrical device? You will need to get the version of that hose with a branch off it to operate the PCV valve. There's no point in fitting the PCV valve if you don't have the vacuum connection to it, and it looks like your small hose is not the right one. Compare carefully with the picture of the VR6 with PCV valve.

 

Once again, I'm not sure why yours (and some others') are like that. There might be a good reason for it. (Edit: on second thoughts, it's almost certainly just garages bodging it because they can't source a replacement PCV valve from VW without buying the whole thing, so they probably just end up bypassing the valve and making it recirculate all the time.)

[aclwalker 3]

The T shaped one in the bottom pic? Do you have to fit that pipe too, or is that unrlated to the PCV valve? I gather then that another pipe will be needed to connect the PCV to the plug thats connected to the intake pipe?

Yes, you would have to fit that. This is the vacuum that drives the PCV valve. If you don't have that then I reckon the valve will just be open all the time, which will be the same as just having a straight hose.

[Critical_Mass 10]

Thanks for the advice. Anyone got the part number for the 'T' shaped pipe also?

[aclwalker 3]

Thanks for the advice. Anyone got the part number for the 'T' shaped pipe also?

Just because I'm a good guy, I looked up ETKA. This hose can be bought separately (it would seem). It's not part of the air intake as such.

 

But, the interesting thing is that two part numbers are listed, so perhaps early VR6s did not have the PCV valve right enough.

 

ETKA says:

 

021133518B for VIN numbers up to 50-R-001 800.

021133518H for VIN numbers from 50-R-001 801 onwards.

 

Now my VIN number is after 50-R-001 801 and I have the T-piece, so it looks like the "H" version is the right number.

For those that don't know how to work out the VIN numbers above, look at the VIN number for your car (on your V5, windscreen, MoT, etc.). The dashes above mean that this character doesn't matter. R is the year (1994) and is a VW code, not related to our old registration lettering. So above basically means that cars made in 1994, but before car number 1801 were fitted with 021133518B, whereas all cars (VR6s) after the 1801st in 1994 were fitted with 021133518H.

 

Sorry, if that's stating the obvious, but I don't think it really is all that obvious when you first see how they specify this in ETKA.

[craigowl 0]

Very helpful posts, aclw. The time you have spent on this will be much appreciated, thanks.

 

People may well need to be referring to them now as these components fail with age.

 

I believe the main reason the crankcase gases are recirculated to be burned in the engine is because they are extremely nasty for the environment. That goo that rots the piping gives you an idea of how bad it must be. Will possibly give you cancer if you dont wipe it off your mitts!

If the engine runs better with all the bits in working order it's a no brainer to keep them in good order by replacing components as required.

[boost monkey 0]

I think they're mainly recirculated craig because if there wasn't any pipework, there would just be a hole in the engine?

 

Obviously they're there to relieve increased crankcase pressure, and also may well be used to give the engine a warm supply of air shortly after starting the engine (off the top of my head!), similar to how the pipe off the exhaust manifold works.

[Toad 0]

I think they're mainly recirculated craig because if there wasn't any pipework, there would just be a hole in the engine?

 

Obviously they're there to relieve increased crankcase pressure, and also may well be used to give the engine a warm supply of air shortly after starting the engine (off the top of my head!), similar to how the pipe off the exhaust manifold works.

 

 

Ummm.

 

Lots of other engines vent to atmosphere, the reason modern cars don't is as CraigOwl points out it's bad for the environment, and modern cars legally have to ingest their own crankcase fumes. It's not particularly good for the engine to be snuffling up hot stodgy air, and it tends to leave an oily residue over the intake piping, also not good.

 

I'm pretty sure it is of no real benefit in giving the engine warm air for cold starting either.

[Toad 0]

But, the interesting thing is that two part numbers are listed, so perhaps early VR6s did not have the PCV valve right enough.

 

Early VRs didn't have the PCV valve, they had wire wool in the outlet of the rocker cover, and a bit of ruber pipe instead. They also have different carbon canister pipes, as the late cars have a take off to the PCV, while the early cars didn't.

 

Hope that's of use?

 

Also my old PCV valve was so knackered the diaphram section had perished, so air could flow in either direction with ease.

 

Edit:

 

After having read back a few posts and read your comments about the pcv valve being vaccum operated, then thinking about mine being perished, this might explain some VRs having a shoddy idle, where the pcv valve is letting unmetered air into the inlet manifold....

[Philmo 0]

Ummm.

 

Lots of other engines vent to atmosphere, the reason modern cars don't is as CraigOwl points out it's bad for the environment, and modern cars legally have to ingest their own crankcase fumes. It's not particularly good for the engine to be snuffling up hot stodgy air, and it tends to leave an oily residue over the intake piping, also not good.

 

I'm pretty sure it is of no real benefit in giving the engine warm air for cold starting either.

 

Hi Tom

I understand the G-lader enjoys the fumes - to provide lub. :)

[Toad 0]

Yeah, although some people like to remove the boost return and just spray lube into the charger.

 

I still need to send you that email, don't I? :oops:

[aclwalker 3]

But, the interesting thing is that two part numbers are listed, so perhaps early VR6s did not have the PCV valve right enough.

 

Early VRs didn't have the PCV valve, they had wire wool in the outlet of the rocker cover, and a bit of ruber pipe instead. They also have different carbon canister pipes, as the late cars have a take off to the PCV, while the early cars didn't.

 

Hope that's of use?

 

Also my old PCV valve was so knackered the diaphram section had perished, so air could flow in either direction with ease.

 

Edit:

 

After having read back a few posts and read your comments about the pcv valve being vaccum operated, then thinking about mine being perished, this might explain some VRs having a shoddy idle, where the pcv valve is letting unmetered air into the inlet manifold....

 

I can confirm that later VR6s with PCV valve also have the wire wool insert. I wondered what it was at first, but then I read that it's a flame barrier! :shock: It's to prevent misfires from making their way into the throttle body and doing some sort of burny damage!

[Toad 0]

I can confirm that later VR6s with PCV valve also have the wire wool insert. I wondered what it was at first, but then I read that it's a flame barrier! :shock: It's to prevent misfires from making their way into the throttle body and doing some sort of burny damage!

 

I thought it was only the cars with the metal rocker cover that had it?

[aclwalker 3]

I can confirm that later VR6s with PCV valve also have the wire wool insert. I wondered what it was at first, but then I read that it's a flame barrier! :shock: It's to prevent misfires from making their way into the throttle body and doing some sort of burny damage!

 

I thought it was only the cars with the metal rocker cover that had it?

Well, I'm pretty sure mine has a metal rocker cover. Are there Corrados with non-metal rocker covers? If so, what are they made of?

[Philmo 0]

Yeah, although some people like to remove the boost return and just spray lube into the charger.

 

I still need to send you that email, don't I? :oops:

 

As long as it's not about pidgeons, sheep or seagulls - bring it on! :lol:

[Philmo 0]

Yeah, although some people like to remove the boost return and just spray lube into the charger.

 

I still need to send you that email, don't I? :oops:

 

As long as it's not about pidgeons, sheep or seagulls - bring it on! :lol:

 

Or glorious puppies! :norty:

[Toad 0]

Well, I'm pretty sure mine has a metal rocker cover. Are there Corrados with non-metal rocker covers? If so, what are they made of?

 

I was going to be a pilock and say wood, but the later ones had plastic covers with captive bolts, rather than studs and nuts.

[Toad 0]

Yeah, although some people like to remove the boost return and just spray lube into the charger.

 

I still need to send you that email, don't I? :oops:

 

As long as it's not about pidgeons, sheep or seagulls - bring it on! :lol:

 

Or glorious puppies! :norty:

 

Caaaw! Caaaaw! ;)

[Philmo 0]

Yeah, although some people like to remove the boost return and just spray lube into the charger.

 

I still need to send you that email, don't I? :oops:

 

As long as it's not about pidgeons, sheep or seagulls - bring it on! :lol:

 

Caaaw! Caaaaw! ;)

 

I knew underneath all the charade - you were only interested in birds - just like Hitchcock! :lol:

[mattwelcer 0]

Just to confirm whats been posted the PCV can be bought from VW as a separate part but only if looking at the Sharan VR6 engine! ;)

Here is the part number for the PCV

 

7M0 128 101

 

As to the FPR, is it better to use the 4bar FPR from the early VR6 model or does it not make any difference. Oh and i have the later OBD2 engine with coilpack so i am pretty sure it has the 3bar FPR. :confused4:

[mattwelcer 0]

Here are the part numbers i found for the early FPR

 

078 133 534 C

 

and the late FPR

 

037 133 035 C

 

Forgot to mention that i have a Mk3 Golf and not a Corrado :wink:

[aclwalker 3]

Matt, I wasn't aware that there were two different versions of the FPR. Is this maybe only on the Golf? Remember that that the Corrado VR6 is 2.9l, not 2.8l.

 

I bought my FPR from VW and my Corrado is 1994 and I got a 4bar FPR when I asked for it from VW. You say "late" VR6. Maybe "late" is after Corrados were stopped being made.

 

You also mention OBD-II. As far as I'm aware, the true ODB-II VR6s were not put into Corrados. They came after the Corrado was stopped being made. I've seen websites selling OBD-I and OBD-II versions of the air intake, for example, and the main difference seems to be that the OBD-II version doesn't have the bypass for the ISV, as the ISV is built into the throttle body on the OBD-II version. As far as I'm aware, NO Corrado has an integrated ISV (unless someone has modified their car). Also, my Corrado has a coilpack but not the full OBD-II setup. I don't think coilpack equates to OBD-II, but then again, I'm not sure how 'OBD-II' is defined with regards to this engine.

 

I'm not sure if any Corrado SHOULD be running a 3bar FPR. I thought it needed the 4bar due to higher displacement, but I guess that was just an assumption on my part.

 

Also, interesting info about the PCV. I should have tried that myself. I more or less did do that though, except I bought the Galaxy version from Ford, which I would hope would be identical, given that the cars are supposed to be identical bar branding.

[mattwelcer 0]

Hmm maybe its just something related to the Golf's.

 

I know the early 2.8 VR6 Golf's had the 4Bar FPR like the Corrado but the later, i think from 95 onwards had the 3bar FPR.

However here in Germany the Syncro VR6 had the same VR engine as the Corrado 2.9 as opposed to the 2.8 in the normal Golf VR6. I'll need to do some digging to see what these later 2.9 Syncro Golf's had 3bar or 4Bar...

 

But as you can get aftermarket FPR's would it be beneficial to put in a FPR with a higher rating?

Or is this only beneficial when running forced induction?

[aclwalker 3]

But as you can get aftermarket FPR's would it be beneficial to put in a FPR with a higher rating?

Or is this only beneficial when running forced induction?

I'm not too sure really. I know that for motorsports some people will fit adjustable FPRs. I don't know too much about it all to be honest.

 

If I was guessing, then maybe the newer ones can cope with a 3 bar fuel system because of changes in the ECU and/or default maps? Perhaps the duty cycles, or even the injectors are modified to keep them open longer to compensate for the drop in fuel pressure? This is total guesswork.

 

I think it's probably best to stick with what is currently in or what should be in already.