Critical_Mass 10 Posted August 7, 2008 Hi all, I'm hoping someone can finally clear something up for me. Bought a set of V-maxx coilovers and they consist of 2 springs. Mine came like - shorter, thinner springs on top and then the larger spring on the bottom. Though on the website i bought the coilovers from showed the pic of the coilovers with the small spring on the bottom and the larger one on top? - see pics. Now, does it matter which way round they are. Like i say every pic i've seen the small spring on the bottom not the top like mine. Even a pic of someones C on here with the small spring on the bottom? Can anyone shed some light on this for me and tell me if it matters or not, and if it does which way round should it be? Also when adjusting the the ride height should the middle spring plates be adjusted also - surely if not the smaller spring will just compress thus less dampening? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted August 7, 2008 Yep, small spring at the bottom. I had this discussion with KW as they also supply the small spring at the top for both ends of the car. They told me to put the small spring at the bottom at the rear, and leave it at the top on the front, but I'm going to swap the positions at the front aswell when I can be arsed. When the car is dropped down, the small spring is fully compressed and from what I could see with my KWs, it was more stable when the small spring was at the bottom. When it was at the top, the small spring and sleeve used to move around laterally quite a lot.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Critical_Mass 10 Posted August 7, 2008 Yep, small spring at the bottom. I had this discussion with KW as they also supply the small spring at the top for both ends of the car. They told me to put the small spring at the bottom at the rear, and leave it at the top on the front, but I'm going to swap the positions at the front aswell when I can be arsed. When the car is dropped down, the small spring is fully compressed and from what I could see with my KWs, it was more stable when the small spring was at the bottom. When it was at the top, the small spring and sleeve used to move around laterally quite a lot.... Bugger! That means they've got to come off now :( good job i havent yet had the geometry setup! I contact v-maxx originally about it and i said that on their website the small spring was put at the bottom where as mine were delivered with it at the top, i was told that it was an old pic (??). Could this be why the car feels a bit 'bouncy' on rougher roads? Why oh why werent they assembled correctly before delivery? :lol: I suppose i better get it stripped down again then. Cheers Kev Gaz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
was8v 0 Posted August 7, 2008 I don't see how it can make a difference? 2 springs (with different rates) stacked will give the same effect no matter which order they are in? I may be wrong :eek: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted August 7, 2008 It's because the helper spring and main spring are coupled together with a sleeve that isn't rigidly mounted to anything. This means the spring pair are subject to sideways movements. If you don't lower the car very much at the rear, and you have the help spring at the top, the springs are free to wobble about. If the helper is at the bottom, the sleeve can "rest" against the damper body threads and not flap about. That's what I saw with my KWs and it made no sense to me to have the helper spring at the top. I rang KW. They agreed. Every other coilover I've seen has the helper at the bottom. Whether it's for the reason above or not, they must all agree it's best at the bottom, otherwise they'd all be at the top, or the middle, or hanging off the back of the car on a bit of garden twine....or what ever... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Critical_Mass 10 Posted August 7, 2008 I don't see how it can make a difference? 2 springs (with different rates) stacked will give the same effect no matter which order they are in? I may be wrong :eek: Yeah thats what i thought, but i thought id ask to make sure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
was8v 0 Posted August 7, 2008 It's because the helper spring and main spring are coupled together with a sleeve that isn't rigidly mounted to anything....................... If the helper is at the bottom, the sleeve can "rest" against the damper body threads and not flap about. Aha! that would make a difference :D If that was not an issue then terms of springing and spring rates then I don't think it makes any difference :salute: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted August 7, 2008 You're right, in terms of spring rates, the position of the helper is completely irrelevant :D It's just a mechanical layout thing. Personally speaking, I don't like the helper springs. They just stop the main spring flopping about when the road wheel is at full droop. I much prefer longer, single rate springs :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
herisites 0 Posted August 7, 2008 Mr Kevster i cant be arsed to email you about this as might as well ask in this thread. I have the Weitecs and my helper springs are all at the top. This wont make any effect to what we have been talking about will it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Critical_Mass 10 Posted August 7, 2008 Mr Kevster i cant be arsed to email you about this as might as well ask in this thread. I have the Weitecs and my helper springs are all at the top. This wont make any effect to what we have been talking about will it? herisites, read above dude. The answer you're after is the answer i got. :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted August 11, 2008 I just got my KW kit, all the helper springs are fitted at the top, as were my H&R ones and my FK ones on previous cars The way i see it is that they are solely to stop the main spring moving about, so are a secondary item NOT for damping, if you place it at the bottom below the main spring to my way of thinking surely it would be exposed to A. more immediate road forces as it will "damp" first before the main spring does and slightly reduce the efficiency of your suspension? with it fitted at the top it will virtually be compressed most of the time even when the car is stationary, if its at the bottom it may not be and B. It may Be more likely to dislodge/break when under hard cornering or when the cars jacked up? Im leaving mine where they are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Critical_Mass 10 Posted August 11, 2008 well changed them over, this weekend and i dont know if its a bit psychological but it seems better on the front handling wise, not so bouncy either(as yet to do the rear). I found that, due to the small spring being ontop the lower spring had been twisting the bellows and the bump stop, both have been damaged! EDIT - reading what kev put earlier, he was advised that the helper springs stay on the top at the front and on the bottom at the rear. I put the helper on the bottom of the fronts and am going to do the rear next weekend. Going to get it all measured up and adjusted too. As i raised the front my 2.5 cm and although it doesnt scrape half as much and is still at a nice height, the rear i think needs raising 1cm or 2. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
