Help, my cambelt broke

[Mamps 0]

Hello

 

I'm new here.

I've had my baby for 9 years now, but I think its nearly the end :cry:

 

My engine cut out whilst i was driving.

 

I have lots of questions!

 

I had just turned right and was going around 20 mph. i thought i had stalled and put my clutch in and pulled over. I did try to start it, but had no luck - did i damage it further by doing this?

 

The RAC man said my cambelt was broken and it would cost me lots to get it fixed.

 

The garage has now said it will be 800 pounds!

 

How do i know if there has been damage to the valves or the pistons?

 

Is it worth changing the cambelt only? - this will cost me 150 pounds!

 

Please Help !!!

[biggerbighugo 0]

sorry to here about that..

you could try getting a cylinder leakage test done first.. if valves were bent more than likely you'd have alot of leakage.

Think it depends on the engine aswell.. with any luck though it will be fine

Good luck with it though

[h100vw 0]

Mamps, which engine are we talking about here??? None of the 4 clinder engines will cost £800 to sort out. Even if you had to buy another head you could do it for well less than 500.

 

On a 16V you have probably done 4 inlet valves. Of which I have some in my garage.

TBH though. You would be as well, chopping the head in against a ported one.

 

The other thing that could have gone would be the crank pulley bolt.

 

Really need to know which engine and exactly what went wrong.

 

Out of interest, what are they doing for the 800?

 

Gavin

 

PS don't spend anything without running it by the forum. We hate to see folk get turned over..... :x

[Mamps 0]

Hi Gavin

 

I have a 2L 16valve Corrado.

 

So, if i ask the garage to do a cylinder leakage test, would they know what i'm talking about? and really, they should have suggested that before. I'm not liking the garage anymore.

 

So, just spoke to the garage. They said for 800, they would put new valves, new head gasket?? (do they need to do this aswell?) and new timing belt kit.

 

I think i may pick the keys off them at the w/e. Anyone know any honest mechanics?

[dazzyvr6 0]

£800 is a bit much,you may be lucky and could of only bent a couple of valves,and a new cam belt and tensioner wont cost a lot either..better post up your location so someone could recomend a vw friendly garage

[Mamps 0]

I'm in North West London - Harrow

[h100vw 0]

Hi Gavin

 

I have a 2L 16valve Corrado.

 

So, if i ask the garage to do a cylinder leakage test, would they know what i'm talking about? and really, they should have suggested that before. I'm not liking the garage anymore.

 

So, just spoke to the garage. They said for 800, they would put new valves, new head gasket?? (do they need to do this aswell?) and new timing belt kit.

 

I think i may pick the keys off them at the w/e. Anyone know any honest mechanics?

 

You have to have a new gasket, the belt cant be more than 15, you should do the tensioner as well.

 

I can't see it needing a set of 16 valves, half a dozen tops. Like I say I have some KR ones at home and I'll check ETKA but I think they are the same. You can have the lot for a tenner delivered.

 

Seriously, if you have the money it has to be worth buying a modified head and using yours as the exchange. You woukd then have a head good for another 100K easy.

 

The costs to fit either are the same. just the belt and tensioner to add.

 

At 800 I'd be able to make money on the job, even with the petrol and digs.

 

It's maybe a half day job to remove and fit, plus the cost of the engineering shop to do the valves, not too many places would do that in house.

 

Gavin

[Mamps 0]

i don't think i can afford to get another head.

 

So, how much do you reckon it will cost me to get fixed?

I don't think its worth spending 800 pounds on it.

 

Does anyone know how much the engineering shop will charge to do the valves?

 

i still don't know if its worth just getting the timing belt changed first.

i'll try to get a cylinder leakage test done first.

[Bally 0]

Welcome to the forum, sorry to hear yr bad news..

 

MY cambelt tensioner seized on my rado last year.. luckly I got away with replacing the belt & tensioner, no valve damage done..

 

goodluck

[davidwort 0]

i don't think i can afford to get another head.

 

So, how much do you reckon it will cost me to get fixed?

I don't think its worth spending 800 pounds on it.

 

Does anyone know how much the engineering shop will charge to do the valves?

 

i still don't know if its worth just getting the timing belt changed first.

i'll try to get a cylinder leakage test done first.

 

Do you know anyone who is capable of swapping a cylinder head over for a few quid cash in hand?

You could buy a complete 2L 16v for 100-200 quid, probably get just a servicable head for well less than 100, a 1.8 one would do. not really worth paying for the head to be reconditioned unless you have it ported and polished at the same time considering how many 16v heads are knocking around these days.

It would be a terrible shame to write it off when I know I could get it fixed up for under 200 quid :cry:

 

David.

[Mamps 0]

Hi David

I don't know anyone who could do that.

I don't mind paying someone to do the job, so if you know anyone please let me know.

Mamps

[Phil.C 0]

Same thing happened on my 2.0l 16v a couple of years ago. All work was carried out by myself. I am a qualified aero engineer.

There will definitely be damage to some of the valves and that is probably all. What happens is that the belt breaks, the valve gear stops and which ever valves are open get hit, and bent, by the rising pistons. Once the valves are bent the engine will still turn over freely. In my engine there was no damage to the pistons or the valve guides.

Cost of repair...8 exhaust valves, new cambelt and a new top end gasket set.

Good luck

 

Phil C.

[randal 0]

I have a 9A head kicking about if you need to go down that route - drop me a PM if you need. :)

[Mamps 0]

So, after all the great advice you guys have given me. I've decided to get greasy and have a go at replacing the knackered cylinder head myself - well actually, my mates doing it and i'm the little helper ;-)

 

1st job was to get the old cylinder head off - we tried to get the head away from the manifold but got stuck with one nasty nasty bolt that was being a pain to get to and to get off. We even tried drilling it, with the thought that it might split the bolt, but its being really stubborn.

 

So, plan B is to take the exhaust manifold off, which is also tricky as you have to get under the car to get the bottom 3 bolts off. Giving them a good soak with some penetrating oil tonight and tomorrow and gonna attempt getting them off on sunday.

 

I bought another cylinder head - thanks Randal! and am in the middle of stripping it and cleaning it.

 

I've got 12 of the 16 valves out - was quite tricky getting the collets out through a socket extention. Am a bit worried as to how i'm gonna get them back in... any ideas??? what i need is a socket extention with a quarter cut out of it i think?!? is there such a thing i can just buy?

 

Any advise would be much apprieciated and any fore-warnings to things looming up....

 

Also, I got most of my things from gsfcarparts, but i'm now thinking i should get some of the stuff from vw.

head gasket set? or at least the head gasket?

head bolts?

valve seals?

cambelt?

tensioner?

[steveo29 0]

the bolts are a sod to get undone, i go at the downpipe joint first, you will a wobble extension bar ....lots of wearing helps

 

a vw headgaskety maybe a good idea...get the rest at gsf

 

you will probably need a few new exhaust studs/nuts while your there

 

good luck..its not too bad a job

[h100vw 0]

what i need is a socket extention with a quarter cut out of it i think?!? is there such a thing i can just buy?

 

My advice is just buy or rent the correct tool before you damage yourself or the head. It is called a valve spring compressor. Make sure you get one designed for 16V heads.

Gavin

 

similar to this

 

http://www.sptools.co.uk/catalogue/inde ... compressor

[keithmac 0]

Good luck mate, you`ll have a big grin on your face when it starts and runs! Halfords do a valve spring compressor which is what you need really to rebuild the head, probably around the £20 mark?

 

If you can get either a Victor Reinz or Elring head gasket you`ll be fine, don`t get palmed off with anything else or you`ll be doing the job twice..

 

I normally change cambelt at the most 30k miles just for peace of mind, not a bad job once you`ve done it a couple of times.

 

Could also fit a camchain at the same time while the cams are out, whay condition is the rocker cover gasket?

[Mamps 0]

Hey Gavin

I am using a valve spring compressor that fits a 16v, just like the one in your link, but because of the shape of the cylinder head, i need to put a socket extention between the valve and the valve compressor on the collets side. So, getting them out was a bit tricky but getting them back will be impossible that way. Any ideas?? theres probably a specific valve compressor i need to get. I have 2, one it too small and my new one fits but i need to use a socket extension with it.

[stevemac 0]

Mamps, Maybe worth taking your cylinder head shopping - to ensure you get a compressor which fits properly. Successfully refitting the valves with a badly fitting spring compressor will be almost impossible.

[h100vw 0]

The one I have has interchangeable ends on it. One for simple 8V heads and the other longer and smaller in diameter for doing motorbikes and 16valves.

 

No need for the extension then. I would suggest you have the wrong one.

 

Like Steve says, you could take the head out with you. I think you won't be able to put it back together without the correct tools.

 

I have always found having the right tools saves so much time. Even when money is tight, it's just the best thing to do.

 

Gavin

[VEEDUBBED 0]

If you think getting the valve collets off was fun,just wait 'till tou try and lever off the old hardened valve stem seals...,virtually impossible without using the special tool.

[Mamps 0]

Made really good progress today - gave up on nightmare nut and jacked the car up onto those triangle things and got the 6 exhaust manifold nuts off in about half an hour!! used a wobble extension - was much easier.

 

Also got all the valves out of the new head - and the stem seals - didn't have the special 'seal remover' tool either ;-) i got it down to 4 minutes each valve (well, some of them at least!) - thats compressing, getting the collets out, the seats, springs, the stem seals - not bad hey! - well for a beginner?! :-)

 

I've been trying to clean carbon off the valves - any tips???

Then i'll grind in the valves and have the fun job off putting it all back together. Went to halfords today and found the right valve compressor with a built in extension thingy on it.

 

What else, oh yeah, got the old head off with not much difficulty - got the 10 bolts off, and lifted it off with ease and with the gasket fully intact - my old head looks really clean actually. Was a bit weird - was sad and glad to see at least 2 of the valves were bent - would have been gutted if we took the head off for no reason, but it was sad to see my baby was injured :-(

 

Thanks for all the good advise and for keeping the old moral and motivation up!! and thanks to my technical guru for showing me the way x

[stevemac 0]

I've been trying to clean carbon off the valves - any tips???

I cleaned the carbon from my pistons last winter with hot water, washing-up liquid & a green plastic panscrubber - one of those oblong things.

[Henny 0]

Mamps, Welcome to the Forum...

 

Good to hear that you've decided to give it a go yourself.... they're really not as difficult to work on as people assume... 8)

 

Get a head gasket set from GSF for your valver... they're as good as the VW ones and are a damn site cheaper!

 

The head gasket set includes the valve seals, head gasket, rocker cover gasket, exhaust manifold gasket, inlet manifold gasket and the rubber O rings for the water flanges which come off the head - Basically every gasket and O ring you'll need to do the job... 8)

 

*edit - damn, just noticed there was a second page of this thread :oops: :lol: *

[Mamps 0]

Henny, thanx for the info - i was still in a dilemma about the gasket set :-)