Anyone converted their 16v from k jet to digifant from a mk3

[olly elworthy 0]

as for ignition tuning on all the cars of similar spec the ignition is not remapped just the base timing value increaced to around 11 - 13 degrees,,

you will find it hard to get a 9a to pink,, power in fact starts dropping off before this happens,,

 

anything you want to know just ask as i will know,,

 

Mine is a 9A with KR cams, I've tidied up the ports and matched the manifolds, basically I have done my best at a DIY gas flowed head and manifolds. It has a magnex cat back system and still has a cat, beleive it or not I prefer it's power with the cat - I've swapped between cat and cat bypass several times.

 

Mine made 162bhp and 152Ibft with the ignition timing at 6 deg BTDC, I've since advanced it to 8 deg and noticed an improvement, particularly in mid range power. From what you are saying I could gain more by advancing to 11-13 deg. I will have a go over the next week or so. Do you reckon there is more power to be gained from mine, or do you think the timing advance you mention is only really right with Schricks?

 

By the way I had Schrick 268/276 cams in it for a month or so, got nowhere with them, coincedently I was doing this at the same time as GVK on club GTI, who also gave up on them.

 

magnex exhaust held are throrttle bodied car back 10 brake,,

the back box design is appauling, i have a thread on here somehwere about it,,

GVK didn`t give those cams a chance and he did not have a 4 branched manifold to work with them,,,,,,,

[olly elworthy 0]

 

Mine made 162bhp and 152Ibft with the ignition timing at 6 deg BTDC, I've since advanced it to 8 deg and noticed an improvement, particularly in mid range power. From what you are saying I could gain more by advancing to 11-13 deg. I will have a go over the next week or so. Do you reckon there is more power to be gained from mine, or do you think the timing advance you mention is only really right with Schricks?

 

even on a std KR you can run 9-11 degrees, i say try a bit mopre timing you might be surprised,, :wink: it will not neccessarily make loads more power but will improve the responsiveness no end,,

[corradophil 3]

even on a std KR you can run 9-11 degrees, i say try a bit mopre timing you might be surprised,, it will not neccessarily make loads more power but will improve the responsiveness no end,,

 

I'll give it a go and post my thoughts in this thread.

[olly elworthy 0]

give it a go :thumbleft:

[aposegil 0]

no sorry but if its that easy why hasnt every other person out there running 200bhp 9A's? instead of spending the monies at the likes of TSR engines etc? that can run into £1000's like i have done and the essential element for a engine to make good smooth power is to get the entire thing balance exactly so there is no unwanted vibrations and a few guys on here can tell you mine when on the rollers would scream for ever never sounding unbalanced

 

also throttle bodies should realise more power than standard inlet as it has less restrictions and a bigger butter fly area so i dont know what you mean the engines are being held back?

 

ill be interested in the figures but as for inters 1/4 times i dont ever take those into account, as cars all off a sudden seem to be quicker but week later in the pod "the cars arent running right" due to their times

 

I used to get 14.5's/14.7's in mine with full leathers, ICE and full inflated tyres and tracting probs trying to pull off , I remember seeing a video of my car from start into 2nd with just front wheels spinning up none stop and yep i got 16.7 for being stupid on that run was a bit aswell that day but all these times are at the pod

 

as for my cams it was Nick (tsr old race mechanic used to run force one) got them specially made for me and all i can rememebr is they are built for torque and have a 10.5mm lift and no overlap as they were made for force induction

[corradophil 3]

magnex exhaust held are throrttle bodied car back 10 brake,,

the back box design is appauling, i have a thread on here somehwere about it,,

 

I'll have a search for it, I'm interested to know what is wrong with the design, surely its a straight through silencer with a perforated pipe running through the middle surrouned by sound deadening material.

[flusted 0]

The whole idea of the wur mod of richining the mixture,helps to run more timing advance without pinking.This is why stealth can get approx 155bhp from a standard 1.816v engine without any other mods except a tune.Valvers run lean high up.

Cos your 2l ke-jet cars cant have the wur mod,it seems you cant run as much advance cos the chip cannot give the fuelling to match?

Also you can run more advance with flowed heads.

 

Mine made 162bhp (1.8cc) with just a 4branch and 2 exhaust cams o and k-jet.

Timing was set to 9degrees with wur mod

 

Both gvk and tubs on clubgti are running approx 186bhp with standard internals and kr cams on k-jet

[olly elworthy 0]

I only write of my experiences,,

 

and your car is very impressive with the torque figures and the 1/4 mile times,, chris mc has the throttle bodied car now and ill get him to put a post or two up on here,,

 

what i meant about the holding back was that when we changed from a magnex exhaust to a supersprint 60mm system we gained 10 brake with another re map,, the air could get into the engine but not out aswell as it should of been able to,,

[aposegil 0]

flusted - your figures sound right to me but form what I understand here is that if you add a 9A bottom end to yours your going to make 40bhp

 

Thats what I cant get round I can see 20bhp and loads of torque as thats what the 9A engine is built for but 40bhp im not convienced sorry

[aposegil 0]

ok I agree with the point you need a good flowing exhaust no point doing the inlet if its only restricted by the exit hence why ive said to all 1.8 16v owner that asked me, to get rid of that down pipe and first silencer and get a 9A or G60 down pipe and cat by past pipe and u will notice a difference

[corradophil 3]

Cos your 2l ke-jet cars cant have the wur mod,it seems you cant run as much advance cos the chip cannot give the fuelling to match?

 

I'm really not sure on that, it is something I have considered. When I was doing a lot of engine work, my dad was also pretty interested and contacted Bosch about re-mapping the ecu and problems with fuelling. From what Bosch said and from what I've read the adaptive closed loop lambda control on the KE-Motronic "might" actually sort the fueling out itself. Information on this seems to be a bit vague, so I'd be interested in other peoples thoughts on this.

 

It would be cool to get a little more out of my valver, and give those G60s and VR6s a run for their money 8)

[corradophil 3]

what i meant about the holding back was that when we changed from a magnex exhaust to a supersprint 60mm system we gained 10 brake with another re map,, the air could get into the engine but not out aswell as it should of been able to,,

 

Ah ok, so really its the diameter of the magnex which can cause a restriction and reduce power.

[aposegil 0]

yeah the extra 1/4 inch makes a huge difference

 

hence why germans like their Bustack exhaust systems loud but worth the power output

[olly elworthy 0]

yeah also we were running a magnex back box on the golf with a twin tail exit,, there is a metal plate in the exhaust with 2 holes in it when you go from 1 pipe to two within the box,, the gasses come out of the one pipe and smack straigt into this plate before exiting,, the silencers buckle with the heat at this point and eventually crack,,

 

yeah as aposegil says you do need the 2 1/2 inch system for decent power

[rmn 0]

So from readin this, a ported head, inlet manifold and exhaust coupled witgh a modded warm up reg and a rolling road session should make a 9a good for the bones of 200bhp with some cams?

[olly elworthy 0]

and a tubular exhaust manifold,,

[aposegil 0]

out of interest have u added any piggy back systems? k-star or v-sam?

[olly elworthy 0]

no,, did have K star on one of them for a while but removed it after the warm up regulator mod was done,,

[aposegil 0]

oh ok so let me get this right

 

youve manged to get out of a 16v tuners been trying for years (i started to plan my engine 6 1/2 years ago and built it 1 year after initial plans so know what was out there)

 

Uve managed to over come the extra fueling probs

 

but not only that youve managed to get same or more power than the engines mentioned here :-

 

http://www.badger5.demon.co.uk/2001/testimonials.html

 

including Kris Valdez 2.1 hing compresion race spec engine?

 

also nearly same spec as the engines you qoute but running throttle bodies and they make less power than you :-

 

http://www.racesolutions.com/gallery/pc ... ordova.htm

 

http://www.racesolutions.com/gallery/pe ... strada.htm

 

this one is running same power as your qouting :-

 

http://www.racesolutions.com/gallery/pc ... illejo.htm

 

and at a fraction of the cost these engine cost to build?

 

can I know whats your average transmission loss? and whats ur actual figures at the wheels?

 

dont mean to sound rude or anything but I honestly think youve hit it big if you managed all that at a fraction of the cost thats out there

[corradophil 3]

aposegil, Interesting links, I take it the racesolutions figures are all the wheels. IIRC mine made 120bhp at the wheels. Therefore about 26% transmission losses, sounds about right??

 

Following this pcordova's car is producing around 205bhp at the fly assuming 26% tranmission losses.

[aposegil 0]

yeah those all will be wheel figures and yes ur right 26% sounds about right and very good actually as very little lose there also been know to have just over 30% loss (two caned engine mounts got to stop double clutching and oilly clutch on my behave due to a small leak) :( doh lol

[aposegil 0]

actually correct myself u can even get less loss my friend corrected me over msn and he got 19%, race padel clutch (not springed), solid & semi/solid mounts (engine does not move at all) engine mounts, lsd and road slick tyres and all poly bushed up front for least movement

[rmn 0]

Here is a little info from a mk3 Rally car that was for sale a few months back.

This is a vw motorsport engie, it gives an idea, i know the power was higher in some of these

 

Manufacturer: Volkswagen

Type: ABF

Displacement: 2.0-16V

Horsepower: 235

Torque: 240

Induction: Verparts Roll throttle system

Heads: stock, adapted

Block: stock, adapted

Main Caps: motorsport grade

Crankshaft: stock,polished, balanced

Connecting Rods: stock, weighed, balanced

Pistons: JS race pistons

Camshaft: Schrick

Valves: size upgraded

Valve Train: adjustble sprockets intake & exhaust

Clutch: hardest organic LUK

Pressure Plate: spring rate motorsport type, balanced

Flywheel: reduced mass, balanced

Exhaust: Supersprint 4-2-1 63 mm

Total Time: 10 000

Races: none, only tests

 

And here is a pic of the engine

[corradophil 3]

Not too shaby is it.

[flusted 0]

i see what your saying about my engine.Its currently 162bhp,i have a flowed head and 2l bottom end to go on it and that will make it same spec as gvks except mine has 4 branch.

Gvk is making 186bhp so mine could make same maybe more?,so that would mean approx 28bhp for 2l bottom and flowed head and a re-tune