16 valve 1.8 top end rattling

[Valerian 0]

Just done a 50 mile round trip and now i have top end rattle.

 

Last thing i did to the engine was fit a new timing belt tensioner.

While i was fitting this the belt came off the bottom pulley so i had to relocate it and line everything back up.

Thinking back....i do remember that originally the top camshaft pulley mark sat half a tooth before the case marking (or seemed that way).

After fitting the tensioner....i'm pretty sure it sits half a tooth (or there abouts) after the case mark.

 

Problem is...the crank pulley mark is on the cambelt cover and the cover itself can be wiggled from side to side thus i don't really know for sure where the crank pulley should sit at TDC.

Even having a stick down no.1 cylinder to check TDC seems a little inprecise.

 

If the cambelt was one tooth out would this cause all the rattling?

[Skimask 0]

Valerian,

To get a valver at TDC you have to use the mark on the flywheel. Be careful because there are 2 marks, make sure you use the correct one!

My Valver also seems to be a half tooth out! I've yet to set it the other way and see if it runs any better!

[Valerian 0]

I'm hoping it is the cause of the rattle.....not entirely sure if the cambelt position has changed at this point in time.

I'm just assuming it could be as that was the last thing i touched on it.

After all i've spent on it lately, i really hope it's not in neeed of a top end rebuild.

 

Another weekend job in store

[Valerian 0]

I can see the marks on the flywheel but i can't see where you have to line them up to

[sciroccotune 0]

should be a pointy bit like \/ cut into the bell houseing case. look at it from the right and you should see it on the lift.

[Valerian 0]

well .....i'm going to have a look at it AGAIN next weekend and if it's anything major that will be the last straw.

I'll sell it for spares or repairs.....all in all it's cost me £1000 so far (what i' paid for the car plus all the new parts i've fitted) and it's still not right.

 

RANT OVER .....lol

[flusted 0]

Top-end rattle could be cam chain? They are only about £10 new.Its quite common for valvers to be a tooth out as the bottom pulley marks are never accurate

[h100vw 0]

Odd for the rattle to start all of a sudden but the chains do make a right row when they are shot.

Gavin

[Valerian 0]

I suppose oil pump failure could be another suspect.....have to try and find my guage.....(which i haven't used in eons)....and check the crankcase pressure.

 

Could be the chain....sounds as if the whole top end is rattling right from one end to another.

Does sound rather camy though.....but different engines also sound different when they go wrong.

Doesn't help that i'm new to VW's to be honest.

 

I was giving it a right royal thrashing (almost to the redline) just before it started though which wasn't wise considering i haven't took the time to change the oil since i bought it.

[Valerian 0]

I haven't looked yet....but i have a question

 

Is there enough room under the cam cogs to remove the cam chain in situ if i use a link remover.

Would save me going through the hassle of removing the camshafts.

[h100vw 0]

Yeah but the chains are one piece you wouldn't gain owt.

 

If the oil pressure were too low there would be bells and whistles to tell you. Unless the warning system has been disabled?

 

Gavin

[Valerian 0]

Yeah but the chains are one piece you wouldn't gain owt.

 

If the oil pressure were too low there would be bells and whistles to tell you. Unless the warning system has been disabled?

 

Gavin

 

I would gain......it would be a lot less bother than removing the cams..... if i use the link remover to split the new chain as well....get my drift?

 

Not sure if the oil pressure connectors are connected the right way.

I know if i swap them round the light/alarm goes off....wondered what the heck it was when it did go off.

 

Found that my temp sensor wires were the wrong way round......temp guage reads correct now.

[h100vw 0]

Those chains are endless for a reason. Not that much time ot lift the cams once the belt is off.

 

My advice is do it the long way.

 

Gavin

[flusted 0]

as Gav says,doin a chain isnt too much hastle.You could try pouring a bit of oil in your engine with it running to see if it quitens down

[Valerian 0]

Many years ago we used to split the links on Ford DOHC chains....used to save lots of time.

There seems to be plenty of oil in the rocker cover anyways but i'll try pouring some oil in there when the engine is warm. Tapping gets louder as the engine warms up you see.

 

FLUSTED....you have P.M. by the way

[sciroccotune 0]

My mk1 used to have an intermittently loud tappet. think it was just due to it being old (not the orig motor was like a 92 motor). always used to go away if i hammered the crap out of it :lol:

 

any luck finding tdc? you could always pop plug 1 out and use a very long stick type thing to show you when the piston was tdc.

[Valerian 0]

Ya ....i have been using a stick to find TDC and the pulley and flywheel.

This rattle sounds like a diesel engine rattle but ten times louder.

[Valerian 0]

Have the rocker cover off at the mo .

 

regards to the cam chain .....seems a bit odd this one......on initial inspection the chain had approx 5 to 10mm play ......but on turning the engine by hand to TDC the chain had no play in it.

 

cams look ok .....could be a bearing

 

Rattle sounds like a cross between a very loud tappet and a very loud exhaust mainifold leak.......hell of a noise it's making

[Valerian 0]

Found this sound file in another thread

 

My engine noise is very similar to this

 

http://www.ghettobeast.com/corrado/raddoenginebay.mp3

[h100vw 0]

They way to check chain wear is measure 'X' links and they have to be under 'Y' in length.

 

Or Half way round the sprocket, pull the chain at 90 deg and see how far it comes away from the sprocket. There is no limit that I am aware of but a new chain doesn't move much more than a couple of mm.

 

Gavin

[Valerian 0]

If i pull the chain half way round the sprocket it won't move at all.

The play i was reffering to was midway between the sprockets.....i'de imagine the sprockets themselves would also wear over time.

Seems to be plenty of oil circulatiing around the head...oil temperature stays around 90 deg when driving and climbs to 100 deg when idling.

Taking the cams off and lifters out today for examination.

[Valerian 0]

when lining all the TDC marks .....crank pulley, cam pulley and flywheel....i've just noticed that the camshaft sprocket mark on the inlet manifold doesn't line up.....exhaust sprocket lines up ok.......looks to be one tooth out.

 

Compliments of the last garage it visited again no doubt....lol

[h100vw 0]

If the chain is under tension because you were just turning it in one direction, the chain won't move. You have to do it with no tension on it. The way I do it is squeeze together the top and bottom runs, between the chainwheels and then see how far it pulls off at 90deg.

 

Those cams are a swine to get just right. One or other always rotates off a bit as you do up the cam bearings.

 

Having it one tooth out makes a big difference to the running.

 

The sprockets don't seem to wear like on a motorbike, maybe the constant oiling has something to do with that?

 

Gavin

[Valerian 0]

okey doke .....think i need to shake off my precision engineering thoughts.