Definitive engine mod comparison

[Toad 0]

I've been thinking a lot about the 263 cams and the gains people are getting and percieving and thought it would be interesting to get a list of actual mods people have done to cars and the actual results.

 

For now I'd be keen on recording info for all the cars, but depending on the popularity could split into the 5 engine types.

 

As far as information is concerned I'd like the following.

 

Car details;

Engine type

Mileage

Year

Dizzy/coilpack (vr only)

Existing modifications

 

Modification

Name

Manufacturer

Cost

Whether it was mapped to take advantage

 

Power/Performance

Peak Hp & Torque @ Revs before fitting

Peak Hp & Torque @ Revs after fitting

Peak Hp & Torque @ Revs after mapping

 

 

Perception: (i.e.) how you felt it changed the car

 

RR graphs to back claims up.

 

Obviously it is ideal if you have figures for performance. And I'd like to see actual figures, not just manufacturers claims.

[davidwort 0]

That's a really tricky one, no two rolling roads or even rolling road days are the same and most modded cars will have more than one modification from 'stock' to confuse things, then you've got to add suspension geometry, tyres... the list goes on as to what can affect recorded output.

 

But, for starters I can tell you I had a RR plot from AMD of my car from the previous owner as a bog standard 1.8 16v with about 30,000 on the clock and 4 years old, the magical sums made the Crank bhp 148 but the road value was 109bhp which seemed pretty spot on to me.

A 2 litre block and flowed head upped that to about 130bhp At The Wheels, which gives you a pretty accurate figure for what to expect from a bit of headwork and a slightly bigger capacity on a 16v.

 

It would be interesting to see what people have for ATW figures across the engines, these don't get banded about much generally.

 

The old Performance VW mag used to have RR shootouts and only print ATW figures which was good as you often got 20 odd cars some modded, some not, to compare.

 

I wonder if we can get a single graph with all the cars on from Vince from the RR day at Stealth coming up?

[iow_corrado_g60 0]

general rule off thumb

 

you lose 40-50bhp before power hits the wheels

[boost monkey 0]

it's more like a percentage figure IOW.

 

what if you're running a 1.4 with 60hp, are you telling me it only makes 20hp at the wheels?

[Goldie 2]

what if you're running a 1.4 with 60hp, are you telling me it only makes 20hp at the wheels?

 

Last time i drove one it felt like it..

 

Ok, as a rule percentage losses are around 20-25%..

[iow_corrado_g60 0]

it's more like a percentage figure IOW.

 

what if you're running a 1.4 with 60hp, are you telling me it only makes 20hp at the wheels?

 

junkie i did say RULE OF THUMB for modded cars (who takes there 1.4 polo on a RR day?)

 

transmission usually takes 40+ bhp its just a known factor both my last G and my mk3 vr both at stealth RR days on Vince's machine have lost i think 38 and 40 something and my old mk2 golf digi had its claimed 112bhp at fly and only 86 i think or so at the wheels

 

i guess that the reason it would be less on a 1.4 is that all transmission etc is

lighter smaller maybe a "EXPERT" could come clear it up.

[Yandards 0]

The only real way to do this is to remove the engine and test the output on the bench at the flywheel for accuracy.

 

As David has already said there are so many factors that affect engine performance, some are that large that you can feel them as a driver - take air temperature I am sure most of us been driving on a nice crisp winter morning and you know the car is pulling really well. Compare that to an air temp change of around 20 degrees (not a huge amount) and you can have a lot less go available to you - this is especially apparant on FI cars.

 

The other snag is that the engines on these cars are built to as tight a tolerance as the newer power units, then factor in wear, abuse ( :scratch: ) maintenance and what may well make 10bhp on one car will only give you 3bhp on another. To give you an example both my Cs have around the same mileage and both now have the gearshift weight fitted, the valver changes very nicely with no crunch, the G60 will occasionally crunch on a quick change. I know the valver was replaced with good quality synthetic gear oil back in 1991, the G60 has just had a change for the bog standard VAG stuff. I will put good money that if I stripped the two boxes the valver would be in better condition overall due to the use of the synthetic oil.

 

(who takes there 1.4 polo on a RR day?)

 

Er, Club Polo? :shrug: ;)