How to build a G60 16v ?

[Sideways Steve 10]

Ok I know some folk have done it and years ago I saw photos of one in a mk2 golf.

 

My question is this.....

 

If I want to Supercharge my KR and effectively create a 16v G60 what would I require ? Can anyone give me a list at all ? Are there mounting kits etc available from anywhere for certain chargers ?

 

Im toying with this idea in my head just now as I really like my C but could do with a bit more power :)

 

Cheers in advance !

[dannyboy 0]

Search my friend,theres plenty on it.Yandards has built one so speak to him or search the posts.

[Sideways Steve 10]

Whats a search ? LOL

 

Only joking Ill have a search again, at the time my search function didnt work as for some reason its blocked through my work even though the forum isnt ! LOL

[bristolbaron 10]

This should help..

[Sideways Steve 10]

LOL cheeky begger, managed to view that on my phone but like I said, lots of stuff is blocked from work and your link to google search is one of them ! LOL

[Supercharged 2]

Your work blocks Google search??

[Jim 1]

I think it's debateable whether there are any real benefits of doing something like creating a 16VG60 unless you want something that is unique and "period" for the car and you want to keep it fairly original (which are perfectly acceptable reasons IMHO!).

 

However if you simply want power, it's arguably going to cheaper and more fruitful to do something like a 20vT transplant.

[Sideways Steve 10]

Your work blocks Google search??

 

Oh yeh, but not always LOL sometimes I can get on, sometimes I cant. Sometimes PH is blocked, sometimes its not. Basically our IT department are completely useless and they cannot set anything up properly and that includes our firewall so some things are blocked one day and not the next LOL its a complete farce and is extremely irritating !

 

---------- Post added at 01:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:45 PM ----------

 

I think it's debateable whether there are any real benefits of doing something like creating a 16VG60 unless you want something that is unique and "period" for the car and you want to keep it fairly original (which are perfectly acceptable reasons IMHO!).

 

However if you simply want power, it's arguably going to cheaper and more fruitful to do something like a 20vT transplant.

 

Jim, Im honestly not fussed in what is actually better or easier or indeed whether there are real benefits or not over the other alternatives, I like to be different and not just follow the crowd which I feel would be the case if I went 20vt. So I guess your right when you say something unique :)

 

I have always been this way and was one of the first in the UK to Turbo charge a Mk1 MX5, I took it to JAE and it was the only one there and as a result it got serious attention but then a year after that and almost every mk1 mx5 you saw was running a turbo setup. I guess you could say rather than following the crowd I like to be the one the crowd follows LOL I know others have done the 16v G60 conversion but its still quite a rare thing so it appeals to me :)

 

With regards to cost, I would argue that doing the G60 is cheaper than the 20vt as since I do the work myself I rekon I can get the G60 parts for less than buying a 20vt and all the other required parts ? could be wrong mind you but Ive not got that far yet as this is all plans for the long term.

[Jim 1]

With regards to cost, I would argue that doing the G60 is cheaper than the 20vt as since I do the work myself I rekon I can get the G60 parts for less than buying a 20vt and all the other required parts ? could be wrong mind you but Ive not got that far yet as this is all plans for the long term.

 

Not sure about that! Bear in mind a decent second hand G-Lader is going to cost you the same as a good condition 1.8T engine... and that's before you get into all the other ancilleries and stuff you'll need to replace. I reckon assuming you were doing all the work yourself apart from any fabrication stuff, your costs would be pretty much the same no matter what you do! But if you do down the 16VG60 route then that's always commendable as doing something a little out of the norm!

[JMC 0]

If you want something fairly unique, why not turbo your 16v? Not many of those around and they have the potential to generate good power.

[Sideways Steve 10]

Not sure about that! Bear in mind a decent second hand G-Lader is going to cost you the same as a good condition 1.8T engine... and that's before you get into all the other ancilleries and stuff you'll need to replace. I reckon assuming you were doing all the work yourself apart from any fabrication stuff, your costs would be pretty much the same no matter what you do! But if you do down the 16VG60 route then that's always commendable as doing something a little out of the norm!

 

Hmm may have to re think it, but I'm actually even considering not using the G-Lader and going down teh route of finding an alternative such as an Eaton or something similar. Fabrication of parts is not an issue so really I can go with anything.

 

JMC -

I had thought about Turbo charging the KR but have turbo'd lots of cars in the past so wanted to try going teh supercharger route for a change, plus the noise you get from the charger is just awesome ! :)

Edited August 10, 2011 by Sideways Steve

[Toohottotrot 10]

How about G-Lader on a 1.8 20 valve? Here's a pic of my mk1 Scirocco

[ATTACH=CONFIG]48484[/ATTACH]

[Sideways Steve 10]

Ooh now that's very cool, did it go well ?

[Toohottotrot 10]

Ooh now that's very cool, did it go well ?

Steve it scares me to death! lol

Very fast, very light and 34mpg!

[coullstar 0]

Another option, never seen a G60T Corrado before. A guy local to me did it in a Mk3 Golf and he loved it.

[Jim 1]

I have seen a G60 Turbo Corrado.. JabbaSport did one and we saw it on track at Mallory Park a few years ago at a VW track day. It was incredible. I think it was putting out over 300BHP and was well sorted chassis wise, etc. It was absolutely flying round and left a lot of other stuff in its dust!

[Rob_B 0]

I have seen a G60 Turbo Corrado.. JabbaSport did one and we saw it on track at Mallory Park a few years ago at a VW track day. It was incredible. I think it was putting out over 300BHP and was well sorted chassis wise, etc. It was absolutely flying round and left a lot of other stuff in its dust!

 

Is that car not on here?! Pretty sure there is/was a g60 turbo on here done by jabba

[G60_Marc 0]

Ive got one :thumbleft: Plenty of pics in the links in my sig and lots of stuff in my blog too.

 

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[aide 0]

are we not talking a supercharger twinned with a turbo though, rather than a straight (but still awesome G60T) if so, there's one of those on here too.

Edited August 10, 2011 by aide
typoooo

[coullstar 0]

G60 block with turbo instead of the the S/C.

[bristolbaron 10]

In my head I think the logical conversions are:

 

16v base car = 16v turbo

G60 base car = 16vG60

VR6 base car = R32

 

My plan was to 16v my G60 over time, wouldn't have even considered 20v or R32 for it, it wouldn't seem right..

[mjcp 0]

How about G-Lader on a 1.8 20 valve? Here's a pic of my mk1 Scirocco

[ATTACH=CONFIG]48484[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

I know that car... gon'a be expensive if you lose a light ;-)

 

mjcp

[Toohottotrot 10]

I know that car... gon'a be expensive if you lose a light ;-)

 

mjcp

That's very true lol!

[Yandards 0]

In my head I think the logical conversions are:

 

16v base car = 16v turbo

G60 base car = 16vG60

VR6 base car = R32

 

My plan was to 16v my G60 over time, wouldn't have even considered 20v or R32 for it, it wouldn't seem right..

 

I wouldn't use a G60 base car for a 16vg60 unless you had a complete KR block to fit - the problem with the G60 bottom end and 16v head setup is crankcase breathing, the 16v has an excellent block breather as it is designed to rev 1/3rd faster than a G60.

 

As you have a KR base you will also need to consider getting some G60 driveshafts as one side of the KR setup is not strong enough for FI use, brakes will need an upgrade as the 256mm ones won't cut it with the extra power.

 

16VG60 - The vast majority of the kits and information on the net is of zero use to us folks who drive RHD cars - the brakes servo prevents the rear alternator mounting solution that is adopted by the rest of the World.

 

Most stuff is bolt on but the headaches are:

 

Using a 16v inlet manifold the TB attachment is on the wrong side - solution is use a 16v scirocco one but you then need an elbow to clear the dizzy or you can use a cut down RS2 item.

You will need to mount both the water temp sensor (Blue and black) there is no off the shelf solution from VW parts bin and you will also need a spacer plate to clear the dizzy (again).

KR wiring harness is completely wrong so that will need removing to retro fit a G60.

Oil feed for the charger, best bet is take that from the back of the cylinder head (where the oil temp sensor lives on a KR).

Mounting the knock sensor, no specific point to place it and the core plug style item that is used on the G60 water jacket needs milling down to fit on a KR block.

Compression ratio - aim for around 8.8:1, stacked head gaskets are more than an acceptable solution but an audi RS2 piston set and rods gets you about that ratio, crank is the same in the KR as the G60.

Belt tensioning - this is biggest pain in this conversion by far the 16v camshaft pulley is wider than the 8v(G60 item) so needs a custom pulley (many companies sell these), you then need to get the offset correct for the alternator (a polo pulley gives the correct spacing), if the alt is mounted in the aircon compressor location then the water pump needs either another idler pulley to get good belt contact or you can just do what VW did and use PAS V belt to drive the water pump as well - this will need spacing to get that to work though.

Finally you need to tension the whole thing, the stock G60 swing arm and pulley sits very tight against the camcover (again its wider due to 16v cambelt being wider) but it does just fit - don't use a solid link or toothed belt drive as this fecks the chargers through shock loading.

 

Simples :)

 

If I were to do it all again then I would use an ABF as a base engine (2.016v) as it has all the extra sensors on it to make use of either mega squirt etc very plug and play, combine that with a bit more displacment and you get a setup that will realise the best of the hardware. I still need to get mine mapped as it feels flatter than my G60 at the moment (which could be gearbox related) but what I do like about it is that it still feels like a valver to drive, not much below 3.5k but above that it really starts to hussle.

[bristolbaron 10]

more talking in terms of progression for each car.. agreed using the 16v block would be an advantage.

now that you've been through the ball ache of completing an engine, how time consuming do you think it would be to do another? would it be much easier second time round? just thinking milling of parts etc/cutting down rs2 inlet etc..