Are VR brakes really this rubbish?

[Will 0]

Just after peoples opinion on the VR6's brakes... From reading other posts on here I've always known the brakes aren't great but I'm mine really are p*ss poor.

Hadn't driven another car for a month or so and used my parents ST170 this morning. First junction and nearly put myself through the windscreen!! It's not just the sensitivity I'm concerned about but the overall stopping power. Anyway, I took was a bit concerned by this so took my GFs 54reg Punto 1.2 out for a spin and can honestly say my VR's brakes were no better than this - if anything I'd say the Puntos were slightly better.

 

Is this just something us C owners have to put up with, this side of opting for something like a Brembo conversion, or does something sound a bit iffy with my motor..?

 

I've done the following to the brakes in the past year in an attempt to improve them:-

 

- Re-washer rear callipers

- Fit Goodridge stainless hoses

- Fit 4 new Pagid FR pads

- Bleed entire system and fill with Dot5.1 following Bentley's procedure (Later re-bled at VW specialist due to concerns with braking performance but with no improvement).

 

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

[mr.ots 10]

I think it's generally accepted that the standard c brakes are not too hot. Driving a modern car and then getting into a c really does show up their deficiency.

 

The brakes in my Toyota Hiace van are sharper and more responsive than in my c (although to be honest they are pretty good). I'm not saying the c's don't work but you do have to press the pedal a lot more firmly to get the desired braking effect.

[Supercharged 2]

What discs are you running Will??

 

I've just changed my front drilled zimmermans back to VAG metal and the difference is amazing, 10 times better than before and the old discs were only 30k miles old...

[HiAsAKite 0]

Don't confuse 'sharp' modern brakes which bite very quickly as you touch the pedal, with progressive braking on the VR which give a gradual build up of braking power as you depress the pedal...

 

 

I don't believe the full braking power when you've got the brakes full on is that bad by modern standards...

[Jez 0]

Yeah, thats true, I had the same problem when I went out in a mates brabus coupe the other week, used to driving a corrado so nearly flipped the damn thing first time I touched the brakes! I prefer the progressive pedal anyways, probably because Im used to it but there you go....Still room for improvement though!

 

Whatever happened to that brembo conversion everyone was on about from the leon? Is it possible or not? Not that the £800 price tag makes it top of the to do list!?

[craigowl 0]

I find the C VR6's standard brakes with stainless steel hoses perfectly good.

Cannot say I have experience of really modern performance cars, though.

[Dr Forinor 0]

Don't confuse 'sharp' modern brakes which bite very quickly as you touch the pedal, with progressive braking on the VR which give a gradual build up of braking power as you depress the pedal...

 

 

I don't believe the full braking power when you've got the brakes full on is that bad by modern standards...

 

I completely agree with that mate. I thought they weren't that good but then I realised it's just that the newer cars have that initial bite which is better, the actual stopping power is decent enough on the C.

 

For example, on my Mazda, the initial bite is so good that you think the brakes are better than in the C, but then you experiment and find out that the brakes are good on the C. You can press harder on newer cars but the braking power is about the same from the start of the pedal movement all the way to the end. Whereas the stopping power increases the more you press on the brake pedal in the C.

[lukeage 0]

Another point Will - the focus and a punto are quite a bit lighter then a VR6. Also i echo the points made by the others, there is less initial bite, but plenty follows up.

[mr.ots 10]

Don't confuse 'sharp' modern brakes which bite very quickly as you touch the pedal, with progressive braking on the VR which give a gradual build up of braking power as you depress the pedal

 

I think there are varying degrees of progressive. As I said before i'm not saying the c's brakes dont work it's just they are a little too progressive for my personal taste. I prefer to be able to use less foot pressure to achieve the same result. A number of forum members have made various modifications to their braking systems to improve braking over the standard setup and IMO I can understand why.

[chrishill 0]

I find my brakes pretty to use good in contrast to newer cars, i dont like the way the lightest touch on the peddle of my dads X-Trail slams on the anchors like i'm trying for an emergency stop, the progressive feel of the corrado brakes gives you WAY more control over exactly how much you slow down by and offers far more feedback than newer cars. In an emergency situation I recon the C's brakes are actually better than alot of new cars i've driven.

[conleycrew3 0]

my brakes feel a bit squidgy sometimes under heavy braking but they stop me if anything better than my mums freelander, i no its a bigger car but it doesnt go nearly half as fast as my corrado.

 

also my mate has a 325i BMW and he stops in the same time as i do and his pedal is rock solid all the time so it cant be that bad, just the progresivnes of the pedal thats longer like people say

[ZippyVR6 0]

likewise I find mine fine, considering it is a 13 year old car and a bit fat lump up front (and a 2.9 v6 engine). plenty of control and they have saved my bumper on a number of occasions.

[conleycrew3 0]

sorry forgot mines a 2.0 16v but hey its a corrado too!

[dub envy 0]

If you think the brakes on a rado are bad, you should try driving a mk3 polo! I've done some impressive 'emergency stops' in the rado after dring my G!!!

 

Wouldn't mind a set of 312's though as I drove a mates Fabia VRS with some on (albiet only round a car park) but was very impressed. Maybe it was just the initial 'bite' being harder like said above.. Although they would fill my 17's better!!!

[Supercharged 2]

If you think the brakes on a rado are bad, you should try driving a mk3 polo!

 

Try a mk1 or 2 polo mate - no servo assistance!

[HiAsAKite 0]

Don't confuse 'sharp' modern brakes which bite very quickly as you touch the pedal, with progressive braking on the VR which give a gradual build up of braking power as you depress the pedal

 

I think there are varying degrees of progressive. As I said before i'm not saying the c's brakes dont work it's just they are a little too progressive for my personal taste. I prefer to be able to use less foot pressure to achieve the same result. A number of forum members have made various modifications to their braking systems to improve braking over the standard setup and IMO I can understand why.

 

Fair enough- and I do admittedly have non-standard discs.....

[conleycrew3 0]

what sort of non standard? is having non standard usually a problem?

[HiAsAKite 0]

Just drilled discs....

 

And I don't find it a problem at all--

[DEL VR6 0]

Well, i think the brakes on my Corrado are really crap. I reckon it ought to be my next mod. Its all well and good having lots of horse power, but its crap unless you can stop when you need to.

[conleycrew3 0]

non standard but drilled?

 

i honestly thought they would have been better than standard.

 

anyone else no or have the same effect?

[Musicman 0]

Try driving a standard Mk 2 Scirocco some time... :gag:

 

[my 280mm disc conversion makes life a lot less fraught]

[conleycrew3 0]

have you tryed driving a corraqdo though because they do feel faint?

[HiAsAKite 0]

non standard but drilled?

 

i honestly thought they would have been better than standard.

 

anyone else no or have the same effect?

 

Drilles 'should' only improve brake fade- as opposed to increase actual stopping power...however I don't know if the are VAG discs that have been drilled or not- there's no sign of any cracking or imperfections around the holes so the quality's pretty spot on.. (30K+ miles on)

[Will 0]

What discs are you running Will??

 

I've just changed my front drilled zimmermans back to VAG metal and the difference is amazing, 10 times better than before and the old discs were only 30k miles old..

 

Pretty sure they're standard VAG. I haven't changed them because the previous owner had them done a couple of years ago. Having said that, the work wasn't done at the stealers so slim chance they could be GSF. Checked the discs but any VW markings they might be are covered by rust. Could be worth changing, possibly with the bias valve...?

 

Do agree with the points about progressive braking, I personally prefer them a bit more sensitive, but I've tried stamping hard on the brakes a few times to check this and the stopping power just doesn't seem to be there. It's not by any means dangerous, just doesn't inspire me with confidence.

Had two 205GTIs before the C and have to say, although they were older I always thought the brakes were very good with no mods at all and pretty sensitive too so don't think I'm being over fussy. Having said that, like Lukeage pointed out, 205s are a hell of a lot lighter!

[conleycrew3 0]

am i right in thinking yours is a VR6 with ABS?

 

abs always seems to take off that "feel" of whats going on with the brake pedal, i find the pedal always tends to go that bit further to the floor if you need it to stop you some more!!! ( you can almost feel like you are bending the pedal lever your stepping on it that hard!)