old to new interior then (whiners)

[selbekk 0]

hi, I just wondered if I could just buy the new style black surrounds / vents / glovebox / heater controls to make my old interior look like a new one? Obviously the door cards etc wouldn't match, and I would need new switches and all, but my main concern is whether I need the entire shell or not?

 

and is the old slider to new twist control heater conversion hasslesome? cheers, kris

[bcstudent 0]

Shouldn't the title be 'Old to New Interior'? Unfortunately I can't offer any advice about the actual question though.

[selbekk 0]

hehe, just thought about that myself. embarassed

[24V Renshaw 0]

You can do it, but you would need to either fit an entire late spec dash, or fabricate a bracket to hold the heater controls properly. Otherwise it all just drops in.

 

Jay

[woody 0]

I am doing this in the next couple of months once my dash has been leathered. New style dash and heater controls, althrough I am going to use the old style switches which do fit and also remove the ash tray and cig lighter so that a Road angel Nav can be installed just under the heater controls. The problem is that if you want new style switches then you require someone to sell you the connectors for all of the dash switches. Also you will need different Heater connecting cables( new style)

 

Also while the dash is out it might be a good time to change the heater matrix for a new one

 

Cheers

Woody

[Shilakadaddy 0]

Its possible to bodge without needing all the new style stuff...

 

Myself and KarlG60 are currently installing a late spec dash into his car. He managed to find a late spec wiring loom, but the guy wanted £50 for it! So instead we're using spade connectors on the back of the switches :)

 

Also for the heater controls, the early cables are being joined to late style ones using chocolate block connectors

 

...will have more details when its actually finished, and will able to say whether it all worked or not :lol:

[24V Renshaw 0]

Its possible to bodge without needing all the new style stuff...

 

Myself and KarlG60 are currently installing a late spec dash into his car. He managed to find a late spec wiring loom, but the guy wanted £50 for it! So instead we're using spade connectors on the back of the switches :)

 

Also for the heater controls, the early cables are being joined to late style ones using chocolate block connectors

 

...will have more details when its actually finished, and will able to say whether it all worked or not :lol:

 

Thats exactly the sort of thing I would hate to find behind a dash if I bought a car. :roll:

 

Jay

[GazzaG60 0]

depends whether you want factory look or factory.

 

its always nices to have full factory but it cost a hell of a lot more.

 

as long as you are happy with your own work, balls to the next owner

[24V Renshaw 0]

My issue with that is not the factory look (you can't see the wiring) its the reliability of it. You are talking about 8+ spade connectors on the back of each switch, some of them are tiny. No thanks.

 

Jay

[GazzaG60 0]

i see your point. think we have all had cars with left over alarms and whatnot.

 

second thoughts it may be less work for yourself to put the proper loom in.

 

i didn't envisage a full connector loom. im with you in that case jay not for factory but for own peace of mind and less issues in fixing.

[selbekk 0]

since I usually take my switches in and out on a daily basis (it seems like it anyways), it would be horrible to have spade connectors on the back of them. I'll rather pay £50 any day than doing something half way. imho.

[bcstudent 0]

I agree with Jay. I feel ill just thinking about that sort of electrical carnage. I hope your mate has insurance with fire cover.

[gradeAfailure 0]

I thought we were all bodge-free on here... :(

[Shilakadaddy 0]

To be fair we're talking about 2 switches on the dash, which will not be taken out on a daily basis. Yes it isn't the correct way to do this, but if it works and saves £50 then I'll be happy with it. If it didn't function correctly or wasn't reliable, then it would just end up being more work and we wouldn't do it

 

We managed to get hold of the connectors for the window switches for a reasonable cost, so i've soldered those in, put heat shrink on the connections and done it properly.

 

Jay you were saying that you did a similar thing with the window switches in your own car on a thread just the other day...

[24V Renshaw 0]

No I actually said you can use the original connectors and have to move 1 pin which could be connected using a spade connector. Obviously its up to the owner what they do to their car, I was just expressing my opinion about it.

 

Jay

[Shilakadaddy 0]

If you don't have the later loom, the earlier plugs actually fit straight in apart from one pin which you can just put a spade terminal on. Not ideal but you can do it. I did before i got MK4 ones.

 

jay

 

Guess i misunderstood.

 

Anyway i agree that if something doesn't work properly, then its a stupid idea. But what we're doing is finding an alternative to using the original VW connections :)

 

As long as it works properly, it shouldnt be a problem.

[KarlG60 0]

Ok my car is the one in question, and theres nothing wrong with the back of these switches, technically the back of switch boxes are made up of metal thats covered... just as a spade connector is itself. Now I'm not saying at all do this it works etc. Not at all. And it is a tempory measure.

 

As for not buying the £50 loom... well you may slate that all you wish but the guy wouldn't post it and it was a fair drive from me and in total would have cost around £100 including petrol. Now being a student holding down two jobs for the car this is the biggest waste of money for two tiny little bits of plastic which in my fair opinion are not even worth a couple of pounds, I'm looking for people breaking VR's and now at the back of CD player connectors as they have the same kind of thing in hope one maybe the right size or can be slightly adjusted.

 

Everything is insulated and labels are on each wire with their positioning.

I know it isn't the "right way to do it" but it works for now... and as I have said it is a tempory measure.

[Riley 0]

spade connectors are for spade terminals (like on the back of the switch),dont see a problem as long as the correct sizes are used and crimped on properly...

thats all the original loom is but covered in a lump of plasic for ease of removal/replacement,its the exact same sort of mechanically sound connection though. :)

 

sorry just found this while searching for heater blower problems :lol:

[selbekk 0]

okay, so back to the topic at hand:

 

can I fit a new style plastic middle dash insert in an old shell, not thinking of the heater panel?

[Shilakadaddy 0]

Yes

[selbekk 0]

and the side vent surrounds / vents too?

[quicky1980 0]

yes

[selbekk 0]

so pretty much I won't need a new dash shell? :D this is looking better by the day!

[quicky1980 0]

i have and old and new dash lying next to me, and the attachments for the centre frame and air vents are in the same places.

so you dont need a new dash

you got any spare late frames? the part that holds the stereo and vent controls?

worth asking

[Junior Jackson 0]

Actually - yes you can fit it but you will need to break out the Dremmel :).

 

I have had my dash to bits a couple of times to see if this is possible. At the moment it's sitting in bits and I'm just about to remove the entire dash shell to replace it with a late one. Believe me, if I could get away without swapping the entire shell I would...

 

The late centre console (plastic part that holds the radio, heater controls etc) mostly has the same mounting points as the early one - the heater controls mount to the plastic console only, so Jay's comment about you requiring a bracket to hold them isn't true. The problem, however is that the bottom cubby hole (which has two mounting screws at the back of it) is much deeper on the late console and the bracket on the dash shell is placed further back accordingly. You could, therefore, fit a late console with heater controls and ashtray, cig lighter etc to an early dash shell but you would have to chop the rear off the cubby hole and you would lose the screw mounting points. (As well as losing all of your loose change in the back of the cubby hole... :wink: )

 

So far I have changed all of the switchgear for late, using the individual late looms all the way back to the fusebox. There is an individual loom for the fog lights and heated rear window switches which plugs straight into the back of the fusebox - get this when you get your late switchgear and have fun getting at the back of the fusebox to remove the old and plug the new in :)

 

Tip of the day is for removing the plugs from the back of the fusebox. Many are single or twin wire plugs, with just a plastic spring clip holding them in, but the loom multi-wire plugs are in the middle of the rear of the fusebox. These plugs have a plastic spring clip at one end and and you can spend a merry half an hour with screwdrivers and fingers trying to get the plug out. If you don't know what's coming next, you will probably do as I did and snap the round plastic pin off the other end of the plug whilst ripping it out. It's only when you study this broken pin that you realise there's a locking mechanism built into the fusebox to hold the multi-plugs in. On the left hand side of the fusebox (looking from the front), there is a small round black button which you press in (to the right) - this slides a bar right across the middle of the fusebox and allows the multi-plugs to be removed when their spring clips are operated.

 

Arse.

 

Once the new plug is in place, the mechanism needs to be pushed back across from right to left, to lock the plugs back in place.

 

If this has been covered somewhere else I apologise - the grief it has caused me is unbelievable.

 

Upshot is that I have full late switchgear with full factory loom and connectors. Apologies for no pictures - that would have made the day even longer...

 

I have also swapped the early heater controls for late - all that is required to do this is the controls themselves and the slide cables (the heater box ends are the same on both, but the late cables have the round 'wound' ends at the control end, as opposed to the 'bent' ends on the early cables). You will also need an electrical connector for the blower switch as this is very different on the later models.

 

The two bottom cables are easy to get off at the heater box end (with the dash in place) - the third one (the vertical one) is bloody hard - I had to remove the bottom part of the ducting to get at it and still had a right job.

 

As an aside - the late heater box has a different design - the top vertical 'windscreen flap' cable is fixed 'upwards', instead of 'downwards' as on the early boxes, which would make it easier to access. I hope this makes sense - difficult without photo's I know...

 

Anyway - going out now to remove rest of dash shell and swap for late unit - total factory swap then. Out of interest - the headlight switch is a straight swap late for early (same connector) and you can swap late outside vents into an early dash no problem.

 

Also - someone said the early switches would fit into a late dash (or possibly visa-versa..) - they won't. Late switches (heated rear window, fog lights, abs sensor, heated seats etc) are a lot wider than the early and so they are not compatible either way. You could dremmel the late one's into the early dash if you wanted.. :oops:

 

With hindsight, I should have taken some photo's and done a proper how-to but I hope the above helps. If anything can't be understood etc just let me know.

 

Off topic but out of interest - 'proper' late heated seat looms will plug straight into the back of the fusebox to keep things nice and factory - you should have two plugs on the end of the loom - a black wire (power) and a blue/gray (switch lighting). There are two connectors on the top of the fusebox towards the right hand side. One of the connector blocks had three connectors plugged in all with black wires and the other had three connectors plugged in all with blue / gray connectors. Both places had space for another connector so i just slung them straight in and 'factory as you like' ™ 8) (there should be a couple of relays in separate holders sat (clipped) on top of the fusebox - the connector blocks are either between or to the right of these as you look at the front of the fusebox. They are hard to see as the plugs plug in from the rear.)

 

Chris.