Leavon 0 Posted November 19, 2003 The engine cut out last night as I pulled up to a roundabout, no spluttering or anything, the revs dropped and it cut out. It started straight away but when I dipped the clutch I notice that the revs seem to drop quite low and then rise again, don't know if this has anything to do with it? Any thoughts as to what this might be? Cheers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henny 0 Posted November 19, 2003 ISV clogged? (Idle Stabilisation Valve) :? 8) Do a quick search for ISV and I bet you'll find a LOAD of helpful ideas! :lol: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 19, 2003 A lot of VRs do that, mine included. I've replaced the idle valve and it still does it. The vane inside the ISV tends to stick, even on new ones. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted November 19, 2003 I'll have a mooch for this ISV thing then, ta very much. I'd like to get it sorted as the thought of the steering and brakes dying on a fast corner don't fill me with joy :shock: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhatVR6 0 Posted November 19, 2003 Common problem. isually the TPS (throttle position sensor) on the side of the throttle body. shame they are about £90 new! :shock: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted November 19, 2003 Hmm, I've done a search on the forum and it seems to be not only a common problem but one without a surefire solution :( Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DEL VR6 0 Posted November 19, 2003 Ive had the same thing on my VR. Was approaching a mini roundabout, dipped the clutch, went to change gear, but the car had switched off. Thankfully, i saw it happen in time and moved out the way of the traffic, expecting to be stuck, but it just started like normal when i turned the key again. Its like some freak thing. :? Try explaing it to a garage, and they say "i need it to happen in front of me for me to find the fault" :x (like going doctors, and just while youre there, the problems all go away!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dr_mat 0 Posted November 19, 2003 If it amazingly happened in front of the mechanic he still wouldn't know what had happened... This particular fault has kept many VR owners awake at nights for the last few years, no-one has really figured out any single cause, but a few people can give you a list of expensive parts that *didn't* cause it for them... :( Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 19, 2003 Common problem. isually the TPS (throttle position sensor) on the side of the throttle body. shame they are about £90 new! :shock: They're £45 now mate :lol: VW have dumped all the old TPS and replaced them with a smaller, generic one that fits old and some current VWs. Only snag is you have to find some shorter bolts as the new housing is totally different to the old one. Then you have to reset the ECU to reset the throttle's zero point, which is 14 degrees or less at idle. Max throttle should give 90 degrees or higher, but you need VAG-COM to check it :? I have a brand new TPS on mine btw and it still cuts out.... Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 20, 2003 You might want to get your engine speed sensor and O2 sensors checked out as I replaced mine today and it hasn't cut out at all. Throttle response and general pull are much improved also. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CazzaVR 0 Posted November 21, 2003 Kev, Where's the engine speed sensor? Easy to replace? How much are they? Cheers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 21, 2003 The engine speed sensor is on the far right side of block, next to the bell housing. Follow the lower of the two wires from the front engine mount to the sensor. 5mm allen key to remove it. They are about £140ish but I can't remember if that excludes or includes VAT. Might be worth checking on the CCGB discounted parts list and I'd get it VAG-COMd firsy anyway, just to be 100% sure. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CazzaVR 0 Posted November 21, 2003 :shock: Cheers Kev- typical VW pricing! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 21, 2003 :shock: Cheers Kev- typical VW pricing! No worries mate. Well, think of it like this. The cam sensor and crank sensor are essentially the same - a magnet - but the crank sensor has a foot or so of wire on it too. Now, the cam sensor costs £30, the crank sensor £140ish. The engine will run without a cam sensor in emergency mode but it won't run (or will run VERY badly) without a crank sensor. Now you can see why the crank sensor is 5 times the price of the cam sensor, because it's essential! Many people don't even know when the cam sensor dies, but you sure as hell know when the crank sensor gives up the ghost. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted November 21, 2003 same happens on mine....at least once every 2 days.......just can't understand why...... :shock: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted November 21, 2003 same happens on mine....at least once every 2 days.......just can't understand why...... :shock: If you take the idle valve out and look at all the black crud that builds up on the internal vane, that could have something to do with it. My old 16V used to do exactly the same thing. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted November 24, 2003 sorry mate....is there anyway you can guide me as how to take the valve out.....before that can you show me where it is... :? .........thanks..... i think its getting worse now...happened 4 times today..... cheers m8 :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted December 1, 2003 The car hadn't cut out again since I started this thread but this morning it stalled 4 times on the way to work so I popped in to my local specialists at dinner (sunset VW in Derby, I highly recomend them if anyone is looking for a good garage in the area). They popped the scanner on it and, hey presto, engine speed sensor fault, which is what Kev mentioned in his post above, so case solved, touch wood :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A16VVW 0 Posted December 1, 2003 The car hadn't cut out again since I started this thread but this morning it stalled 4 times on the way to work so I popped in to my local specialists at dinner (sunset VW in Derby, I highly recomend them if anyone is looking for a good garage in the area). They popped the scanner on it and, hey presto, engine speed sensor fault, which is what Kev mentioned in his post above, so case solved, touch wood :DLet us know in a few days if the engine speed sensor solved your fault mate. Mine cuts out as well but wont start straight away. Have been ignoring the prob for a while now but can be very awkward at roundabouts/traffic lights. Dan :lol: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted December 2, 2003 Unfortunately the problem became unignorable(?!) yesterday, but I was pleased that the fault instantly popped up on the VAGcom. I'm getting the sensor replaced tomorrow, so I'll post in a few days time to let you know the results. Gives you the opportunity to practice heel throttle blipping anyway :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted December 2, 2003 Yes lengthy starts are down to a faulty crank sensor too (G68). I replaced mine about 3 months ago and it came up as faulty on VAG-COM last night, so it's going back to VW for replacement. Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted December 2, 2003 Found another potential cutting out cause tonight. I noticed in VAG-COM another error, "Throttle adaption limit reached - Idle stabilisation valve". I checked measuring block number 3 and sure enough, the throttle angle at rest was just under 16 degrees, which is too high. The ECU needs to see 14 degrees or less to switch the idle valve on. I did wonder why the engine zooms up to 1500 rpm when started, now it just has the ECU commanded 1100rpm blip and then settles to 680. Haven't driven it since adjusting the throttle sensor (had to drill the mounting holes out to 4.5mm) so I'll let you know tomorrow if it worked or not but my theory is the idle valve wasn't switching on due to the high TPS angle....we shall see! Kev Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted December 3, 2003 Kev, is the crank sensor and the engine speed sensor the same thing? If so then this could also explain why my car takes a while to start sometimes, the battery is fine and the only other thing I could think of checking was the starter motor. Also whereabouts is the engine speed sensor in the engine bay? The guy at the garage wants to clean it before he orders a new one as the part is so expensive. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DEL VR6 0 Posted December 3, 2003 It happened to mine again today. Was turning right, and the steering went rock hard. Looked down into the instrument cluster, and all the red lights were on! Its so annoying when it cuts out like that. Thankfully, with this thread in mind, it wasnt so much of a panic - as it had been the first time it happened. As the car was still rolling, i put it into 2nd, and gently took my foot off the clutch, and it started straight away, and was fine thereafter. Gonna have to get to the bottom of this tho. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leavon 0 Posted December 3, 2003 Del, apparently bump starting like that is not such a good idea as it can stretch the timing chain(?) which I presume could be expensive :( Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
