No marking on flywheel for TDC

[sam2.0 10]

Just re-doing my timing after finding the notch was sheared off my cam pulley (Thanks to '87 Jetta 16v' for a replacement @ £10).

 

I've cranked the engine over by hand and checked the inspection hole even few degrees of movement and saw nothing, so I just set the engine to 'just before TDC' for safty and its still out. Also, when putting the belt onto the cam pulley, it would fit in 2 different teeth, I opted to make it tighter to the right of the cam pulley, so the slack was taken up by the tensioner (left of the cam pulley).

 

I could turn it over by hand easily, so nothings hitting.

 

What would be the next step, just go for TDC?

[bmwcompact 10]

I'm guessing you have a 2l 9A same as me. I changed my belt last year and have recently reset my ignition timing after fitting a recon distributor so should be able to help. However I am not clear about whats happened, what you have done, and what your problem is now.

 

I thought this was an interference engine, so my first question is: if the cam pulley notch was sheared how/when did this occur and have you bent some valves even though you say you've turned over the engine by hand?? Have you removed the camshaft cover to access the marks on the camshafts and camshaft pulley? How are you determining TDC if you say you've found no flywheel mark?

 

My 9A has only one mark on the flywheel seen through the inspection hole (its at TDC) and is used for setting valve timing when changing the belt. It easy to miss it when turning over the engine by hand. Valve timing is set by marks on the distributor end of both camshafts, a mark on the cam pulley and the flywheel mark. Its easy to be 1 tooth astray when fitting the belt and this only becomes obvious when you turn over the engine in the direction of rotation and confirm the camshaft pulley mark and TDC mark on flywheel are spot on. Taking up the slack on the tensioner doesnt necessarily mean you got it right.

 

Until you are sure that the valve timing is correct, you shouldnt think about the ignition timing.

 

But my real concern is about whether you've lost the relation between crankshaft and camshaft and done some damage??

[sam2.0 10]

Thanks for the feedback.

 

Basically I have aligned the head, cam marks and ten the cam pulley. I think the old pulley sheared after my first attempt at lining up the timing.

 

I then used the old technique of dipstick in cylinder 1 to find TDC, the made the cam belt tight on the non tensioner side, then tightened sad tensioner, to pick up slack.

 

By removing the valve cover I am able to align the cams and pulley correctly, I then am left with the dip stick technique for TDC, as I've failed to see the flywheel marker.

 

I'm asking if there is an other way to confirm TDC for the pistons, as my attempt seems to have failed.

 

I've not taken the head off to confirm valve damage, I'm assuming I havnt! I will do a compression test tomorrow to check for air leaks.

[destructiv dave 0]

Thanks for the feedback.

 

I then used the old technique of dipstick in cylinder 1 to find TDC.

 

Rotate the crank 180degrees and try again.

[sam2.0 10]

I tried the whole 360 degrees.

 

All back together now, every so slightly out still and it's idling at 2500rpm.

[vw rule 19]

The timimg marks on the Corrado and Golf MK2 four cylinder engines are all the same,

you've got the mark on the top on the front of the cam pulley which lines up with the notch in the cam cover,

and there's a second mark on the back of the cam pulley which lines up with the top of the head (so you can't really get these wrong)

 

There should be a timing mark on the side face of the flywheel you can only see this mark through the small inspection window,

the inspection window is a small hole at the top front of the bell housing on the gearbox (which SAM2.0 has already told you about)

If you say you've got no TDC mark on the flywheel side face, then the flywheel may have been fitted wrong by someone else ??

Or the flywheel is just coked up with dirt and oil which is coving over the TDC mark ??

(THERE IS ALWAYS A TDC MARK ON THE FLYWHEEL SIDE FACE, ALWAYS)

 

There is also a auxiliary shaft which drives the distributor on the 8 valve engines,

theres a pulley on this shaft as well which will need to be timed up.

(BUT LIKE I SAY THIS IS ONLY FOR THE 8 VALVE ENGINES FOR THIS PULLEY TO BE ALIGNED UP CORRECTLY)

 

If yours is the 16 valve engine then you don't have to worry about timing this auxiliary shaft pulley mark,

up with the crank shaft pulley as the auxiliary shaft is only driving the oil pump.

 

 

Are you sure you haven't put the can shaft pulley on back to front which you can on the 8v & 16v heads,

because if you have it can course the engine to rev or idle erratically,

plus also it will make the cam belt catch on the cam belt cover and back plate,

(THIS COULD WELL BE THE NOISE YOU HAVE)

 

Yeah that's what it sounds like to me you've got the cam shaft pulley on back to front,

which will also break off the woodruff key which is made into the pulley it's self.

I thought you said you had already broken off a woodruff key on the original pulley ??

I'd recheck your valve timing if I were you.

 

 

The cam belt when fitting these you should always have the slack on the tensioner side,

if you haven't then your trying to fit the belt incorrectly,

plus the cam shaft pulley should be the last pulley to fit the cam belt on to, always.

(START FITTING THE CAM BELT TO THE CRANK PULL, AUXILIARY PULLEY, TENSIONER AND LAST OF ALL THE CAM SHAFT PULLY)

 

Plus also you can get a noise from the tensioners as they rib on the lower cam belt cover,

because if you don't have the correct twin pin tensioner adjusting tool you won't be able to pull the tensioner up enough,

away from the lower cover.

 

 

You have to be very careful as these engines can smash to bits,

(MEANING THERE IS A HIGH RISK CHANCE OF BENT VALVES, IF YOU'VE GOT THE TIMING OUT TOO FAR)

 

 

 

Hope this helps mate.

 

Si :thumbleft:

[Supercharged 2]

What engine is it???

[sam2.0 10]

VW Rule - The cam is no issue. I have been un able to see any markings, I've rotated it 4+ times to try and see. You CANNOT put the cam shaft pulley on the wrong way, as it has a woodruff key like you say.

 

Supercharged - 2.0 16v 9a.

[Yandards 0]

Right, if the flywheel has been replaced then the VW supplied items only come with a '0' mark on them, it is up to the installer to mark out the timing mark on them.

 

Spotting the mark on an old rusty flywheel is bloody difficult, best bet is to try TDC on the cambelt end (although this could be 180 degrees out at the flywheel end) and then use a flat bladed screwdriver to level the flywheel forward and backward a few degrees to see if you can see the timing mark.

 

If you can't see it then rotate the cambelt end through a full revolution and check the flywheel end again.

 

It is impossible to fit the flywheel around the wrong way or upside down as first of all it would stick on the block due to the offset and secondly it won't fit as the bolt hole pattern on the crankshaft to flywheel alignment is eccentric and will only go on one way.

 

I have attached an image of the timing mark from a G60 (same flywheel) note that the best way to try and see the mark is with a good torch looking over the battery side of the engine bay.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]72680[/ATTACH]

[sam2.0 10]

Turns out there is 1 mark! The mark was just a line. Took for ever to find it!

 

I set it up on the mark and it was lumpy, so then done 6 degrees (3 teeth) and still lumpy.

 

Could it be something else now? bent valve? I need to do a compression test tomorrow.

[Yandards 0]

Turns out there is 1 mark! The mark was just a line. Took for ever to find it!

 

I set it up on the mark and it was lumpy, so then done 6 degrees (3 teeth) and still lumpy.

 

Could it be something else now? bent valve? I need to do a compression test tomorrow.

 

There should be a '0' above that line - worth looking for if you can't see it to confirm that you only have the 0 deg mark and are not using the 6 deg BTDC mark that will be just a line.