GAZ Gold Coilovers question

[Rams 0]

Hey

 

I've been having problems ever since I installed this coilover kit. Think its my own fault but something is not correct.

 

I did have heavy steering and issues with the bearings getting damaged and this was due to someone tightening the strut nuts with a torque gun and we found when we removed the struts that there was a big washer than we thought didn't need to be there.

 

Called GAZ and they said you don't use this washer and sent them a picture... Still confused why they sent it out in the first place. Anyway, since removing the washer the steering feels great and everything fine but the struts really stick out of the housing. See pictures. At present the wheels are turned to lock on the picture.

 

I do feel a bit of wheel wobble at certain speeds and not sure if this is the rack or if its something to do with the suspension.

 

Before I removed this washer the thread on the strut was damaged where is wasn't doing up tight enough and causing movement so replaced mounts and bearings and had the thread fixed and now as I say it feels fine but I've never seen so much thread showing up through the mounts....

 

Can anyone help or confirm it looks wrong?

 

Cheers

Rams

[mic_VR 3]

I've got GAZ on mine mate and they don't stick out that far. To be fair I didn't install them, and I'd say the steering is ok if maybe a little heavy.

 

 

Sorry the pic isn't good but hopefully you'll see what I mean. Looks normal.

[Mike Edwards 0]

Rams, it looks like you forgot something. The top mount bearings perhaps? :)

[Kevin Bacon 5]

I had to use a number of packing washers on my Gaz Golds because the top cap was for a mk2, which isn't hat shaped like the VR6's. They might actually supply the right shape cap now though. My threads didn't poke out anywhere that much either!

[Rams 0]

Top mount and bearings are there....

 

It's been bugging me for a while and not sure what to do?

 

I was sure that the threads shouldn't be that high but when the washers were fitted the steering was heavy and didn't feel right. As soon as we removed those washers the steering was much better and felt more correct.

 

The steering wheel wobble is just at higher speeds, I've had tyre balanced and 4 wheel alignment done and wonder now if my symptoms are to do with these being fitted incorrectly.

 

When the washers were there you couldn't tighten them down properly and once you did you could see the bearing was being squashed so we replaced the mounts and new bearings and now the bearings don't get squashed but that movement before cause the thread to be damaged so we removed struts, fixed thread and were able to tighten them so not moving but outcome was what you see....

 

Has anyone got pictures of what I need to have from when you put the spring on, cap, bearing and mount and top nut.

 

GAZ were useless but I might try them again. He said the washer was for a mk4 and not required. First of all he said you use it if you need to? Which didn't fill me with confidence.

[Rams 0]

I don't have part number 9 but I believe these are for the older Corrado? Could some confirm? You would need the special tool to tighten them up with little lugs. My mk2 golf coilovers used to have them from memory. Long time ago now!

[mic_VR 3]

Did you change the spring plates when you fitted these?

[Rams 0]

This is the washer that we removed, you can see the spring cap has a shiny ring of metal where it was pressing on it.

 

This is the spring cap used.... Does that look correct?

[Rams 0]

Mount and spring cap

[Rams 0]

I've got GAZ on mine mate and they don't stick out that far. To be fair I didn't install them, and I'd say the steering is ok if maybe a little heavy.

 

 

Sorry the pic isn't good but hopefully you'll see what I mean. Looks normal.

 

Your struts are definitely lower than mine but your gap between mount and housing looks bigger? Could this be where I'm going wrong?

[KipVR 1]

I hate it when you buy a product from someone and they cant be bothered to even help you out. Hope we can help!

 

Probably best to take the strut off complete with top mount, and then take a photo with all the parts in an exploded view.. But of a chore but probably the only way you'll get an informed answer!

[mic_VR 3]

Hey mate, sorry I'm away so viewing this on my phone. If the gaps look wrong then suggests either incorrect mounts or plates. The vr are quite small and relatively flat. I'll post a pic if I can find one.

 

I've never seen a washer/spacer like the one in your pic.

[Mike Edwards 0]

Rams, the parts diagram you posted is of an early 4-cyliunder, rather than a VR6 (No.9 is a threaded bush that holds the combined top mount and bearing on to the strut).

 

In your pictures I don't see the upper spring plate from the original suspension that the bearing sits on. You will need this - in addition to the top spring plate of the Gaz coilovers - in order to run the VR6 top mounts.

 

---------- Post added at 4:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 4:16 PM ----------

 

That spacer in the photograph would probably fit between the Gaz top spring plate and the VR6 top spring plate.

 

HTH

[Rams 0]

Thanks for input guys, I remember now how I fitted them.

 

The spring over strut, GAZ spring cap, bearing, mount, into housing with nut washer, top collar and lock nut.

 

Originally, we had that washer on top of the GAZ spring cap, then bearing and mount but when the nut tightened down it was squashing the bearing so it turned move freely.

 

So is the jackpot that I haven't used my original spring plate cap?? What s seen in the pics and what I've described above would indicate the original cover spring cap is missing.

 

Is that a definite on a late vr6 that you need to use the original cover plates?

 

So should it be GAZ spring cover, bearing, original plate, top mount, nut washer, then collar and lock nut.

 

Or GAZ spring cover, bearing, top mount, then original cover and then nut washer and collar / lock nut?

 

This would take some of the height away!

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Think there would be a notable handling difference once they are fitted correctly?

 

Cheers

Rams

[Mike Edwards 0]

Given that the last set of coilovers i fitted to a Corrado VR6 went on in 2007 (KW V1s), it's possible that my memory is playing tricks. However, I'm pretty certain that the original plate has to be there, so i suggest that you try: GAZ upper spring plate, spacer, original upper spring plate, bearing, top mount, nut. Fit this to the front upright and feed the top mount up into the strut tower. Once the car is back on its wheels, add the plate and lock nut visible in your original pictures. This is for a VR6 top mount BTW.

 

And yes, this will do radical things to the handling compared to what you've got atm...

[mic_VR 3]

Ok tried to find a pic on my phone but if you go to this link you'll see what standard spring plates look like.

 

http://www.veedubmachine.co.uk/index.php?main_page=popup_image&pID=1426

 

Do gaz supply modified plates or are the standards to be reused? If the standards are used then I'd think spring plate, bearing, mount, top cover, washer, bolt.

[Rams 0]

I went down to my lock up and found what I think is my original suspension, not sure if it was part of the mk3 VR stuff I bought when taking the obd2 bits of if they are johns spares from 94 VR....

 

Those standard plates are there, very rusty as you can see...

 

When those thick washers were fitted the stuts looked as they should from the engine bay but steering wasn't right.

 

I will call GAZ Tom and see what they say. I can send them pictures again but I did fit them when on the phone to GAZ last time and he confirmed, spring plate, bearing mount. No mention of retaining the old spring plate but this hat on the original looks talker than the GAZ one so I'm thinking your right and they could be related to my fitment problems.

 

There was no other way that thick washer GAZ supplied would fit, except on top of the GAZ spring cover cap. But after experiences issues with heavy steering / movement due to not being able to tighten the washer not down and when you did it would squash the bearing causing the poor steering etc.

 

Also its started to wear on the GAZ cover plate which really meant it wasn't supposed to be there.

 

My top collars look fine and of the late type.

 

I'm trying to be patient with it but recently a few things seem to be wearing on me. All this work / time/money and I can't get my front suspension fitted properly. Lol

 

Kev mentioned the top hats and GAZ making them for mk2's but haven't heard of others having issues.

 

Thanks for persevering!

[Kevin Bacon 5]

The spring over strut, GAZ spring cap, bearing, mount, into housing with nut washer, top collar and lock nut.

 

Originally, we had that washer on top of the GAZ spring cap, then bearing and mount but when the nut tightened down it was squashing the bearing so it turned move freely.

 

 

That's how it's supposed to be. As I mentioned previously, the spacer washers are there to provide clearance between the spring cap and the bottom of the mount. That's exactly how my GGs were and they worked fine. When I had mine, Gaz weren't officially making the Golds for the MK3/Corrado so I had to use a MK2 spring cap with a couple of these spacer washers. It was all a bit of a bodge really and the quality was appalling too. Never again!

[Rams 0]

I've called Gaz this morning, sent them 5 emails with a good description and he said we will get to the bottom of this. Just waiting for the technical guy to come in and they should be calling me back later.

 

Will update.

 

Rams

 

---------- Post added at 10:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:01 AM ----------

 

That's how it's supposed to be. As I mentioned previously, the spacer washers are there to provide clearance between the spring cap and the bottom of the mount. That's exactly how my GGs were and they worked fine. When I had mine, Gaz weren't officially making the Golds for the MK3/Corrado so I had to use a MK2 spring cap with a couple of these spacer washers. It was all a bit of a bodge really and the quality was appalling too. Never again!

 

Howdy

 

Once that washer is fitted on top of the spring cap, when the bearing and nut washer/mount are fitted its squashing the bearing in order to get it tight otherwise it's just moving around. That's what damaged my threads on the struts. So after it was re threaded and the washer removed if would tighten up fine and not squash the bearing.

 

I can't think of another place the washer goes for it to work? Plus the tech guy back then said you only use it if you need to then he said it was for a mk4?

 

Lets see what Gaz come back with.....

 

Did your kit come with the same washer as mine did?

[Kevin Bacon 5]

It's Dave Lyons you need to speak to really. He's the main guru and came from Leda.

 

If the washer's OD matches the bearing and the correct VAG nut is used between to tie it all together, I can't see why the bearing would get crushed. Something's not right there. Takes a lot to crush ball bearings!

 

Mine didn't initially come with the washers, but when my MK2 spring cap was rubbing on the bottom of the top mount, a couple of washers was their solution and it worked for me. No crushing etc.

[Rams 0]

Good morning

 

Had a reply from Gaz below

 

Ramsay,

Let us have your full address I will send you a new top

collet & a different spacer that fits into the counterbore on the bearing,

this will then stop the bearing falling down to far on the piston rod &

support it when you do up the top nut as at the moment you will be crushing

the bearing when doing this.

 

Regards,

Gaz

 

Fingers crossed that's it

[Kevin Bacon 5]

OK, so they're suggesting the washer or top cap isn't the right diameter for the bearing? Well that would certainly cause you some issues!

[Rams 0]

Indeed, thanks for the comments.

 

I will post up pictures when the new bits arrive but Gaz were very helpful this time so I feel much better.

 

Looking forward to getting the suspension setup correctly and hoping I will notice a difference.

 

Rams

[Mike Edwards 0]

Hmm... On the standard VR6 strut the bearing fits over the thread so that the centre seats against the end of the threaded section of the shaft (and is held there by a nut that goes on top of it). The upper spring plate butts up against the underside of the bearing, allowing the lower part of the strut, the spring, and the upper spring plate to rotate relative to the shaft. The top cap, and the washer are always going to be the wrong size...

[Rams 0]

This is what I received today.

 

So I'm guessing, spring cap, bearing, washer and top mount?

 

Will take the trust out next Monday and try these out...

 

I'm thinking this washer wouldn't foul the bearings as it will sit in the middle of the bearings so this might work?