G60 lost 2 cylinders, aarrgghh!! help?

[Henny 0]

OK, so I've known that my fuel pump has been weak for a while and have had a replacement one in the boot of my car for a couple of weeks while waiting for time to swap it over... :oops:

 

Anyway, 2 sundays ago I was driving home from work, sat at about 40mph in 5th when the engine starts mis-firing... "ah bugger, there goes the fuel pump" thinks I... :roll:

 

So I pull over into a lay-by and the car's idling, but sounding like a sack of.......

 

Popped the bonnet and pulled off plug lead number 1... no difference, so it's not firing on one... put the lead back on and try lead 2... same again, no difference... :huh: So I try 3 and then 4 and she almost dies when I get those ones off... "Hummm" thinks I, so I pull off 1 AND 2 at the same time to find that this makes no difference to the mis-fire and that she's still running like the same sack of.... So I've lost BOTH cylinders 1 AND 2... :? :crazyeyes:

 

So, the Very Very nice man from the AA comes out, check spark on all 4 cylinders and there's a nice bright spark. Checks compression and it's identical on all 4 cylinders, although he reckons it's a little low for a modern engine (yeah, it's forced induction you muppet, of course it's a little low... :roll: ) it IS identical...

 

One tow home later I replace dizzy cap, rotor arm, plug leads and plugs to find that she fires up perfectly and runs on all 4 cylinders....

 

...for about 5 seconds and then drops to running on 3 and 4 only... :(

 

OK, so I change the fuel pump and fuel filter and..... no difference... :?

 

So, at this time, I know it's got a spark at the right time on all 4 cylinders, I know the fuel delivery is OK to the FPR and I know the ECU is telling the injectors to fire as it's running on 3&4 quite sweetly when you consider that it's not firing on 1&2! So, I decided to have a look at the wiring to the injectors and "hey presto" the wiring loom's fooked and very nasty looking... :oops:

 

Another £60 at VAG later and I've got THE last injector wiring loom for a G60 engine that VW has (and, from the sounds of things, will ever have! ) so a couple of nights ago I fitted that thinking it's gonna solve my problem.... It didn't... :(

 

 

Anyone else got any ideas? I'm stumped...

 

Tonight I'm gonna take the injectors out and swap 'em around to see if that changes which cylinders aren't firing, but if that doesn't sort it, I have no fecking clue what it could be...

 

The weird thing is that when you start the car after it's been stood for a while, it fires up happily and runs sweetly for around 5 or 6 seconds and THEN looses 1&2, so I can't think it's mechanical... There's no knocks, bangs, rattles etc, it just isn't running on cylinders 1&2... :?

[mrbeige 0]

Sounds like the injectors are fooked to me. If you are getting spark and fuel to the FPR ok. I'd wait and see what the outcome of swapping the injectors over is....

[Henny 0]

yeah, but they were Brand new red tops and have only had around 20K miles of use... :|

 

What I can't understand is why 2 injectors would go down at the same time... :|

 

I'll post up my findings from tonights session tomorrow, but any thoughts would be most appreciated in the mean time... 8)

[biggrim 0]

Henny,

 

this sounds like how mine is running (oh bugger) and it's in at VW today getting diagnosed. They've told me there is a problem with the battery and further checks need to be done once that is replaced.

 

Could it be the battery? (Silly question perhaps)

[m3evo 0]

Hi Henny, Just a thought have you tried for air leaks at the inlet manifold on No-s 1 and 2 try spraying WD40 at the back of the manifold while running and see if theres any change in engine speed, worth a try, cheers Dave

[Henny 0]

biggrim, nope, tried 3 batteries on it and the one that's normally on there is almost brand new and big enough to power a truck! :lol:

 

It really is just not firing on cylinders 1 or 2.... to the point you can take out the spark plugs and it'll actually run quite well, but if you remove the plug lead for either 3 or 4 then it won't go...

 

It does highlight just how well balanced it is though I suppose! :lol:

 

m3evo, tried that too, no air leaks...

 

Thanks for the ideas, keep 'em coming... 8)

[biggrim 0]

i'LL LET YOU KNOW WHAT VW SAY ABOUT MINE

[Lippy 0]

have you tried the basil fawlty approach?

 

 

hope you get it sorted mate :(

[Walesy 0]

^^:lol:

 

It must be difficult to keep the faith , when you've put as much time and effort into it as you have, i'm sure you'll manage to sort it though.

 

Sorry I can't be of any help mate, i'm a know-nothing :(

[Henny 0]

Lippy, if you go past Nether Alderly Mill (where I got towed home from) you may well see some broken branches lying around... ;) :lol:

 

Keeping the faith's not the problem, I still love working on the car and love driving it when it's working, but I simply don't have the time now that I'm about to get married and working towards another promotion at work... :|

[olly elworthy 0]

bound to be a silly little prob hennmiester,, you`ll find it this eve,,

[Henny 0]

problem with my car is that silly little problems seem to cost a sodding fortune to fix... :(

[mk2_20vt 0]

Have you tried checking if you are getting voltage at the 2 injectors?. You can try a 12v LED in the connector.

[Henny 0]

mk2_20vt, yup, that's why I changed the (£60!!!) wiring loom to it... there's deffo 12.8V and a switched earth getting to all 4 injectors...

[peteTDI 0]

It really is just not firing on cylinders 1 or 2.... to the point you can take out the spark plugs and it'll actually run quite well, but if you remove the plug lead for either 3 or 4 then it won't go...

 

It does highlight just how well balanced it is though I suppose! :lol:

 

 

 

Thanks for the ideas, keep 'em coming... 8)

 

if your runing the engine with no plug in 1 or 2 can you smell petrol in the gas coming from the spark plug plug hole??

 

use a node light or 501 side light bulb on the injecter wiring on number 1 or 2 to see if it pulsing the injecter(the light should flash if ok)

[Jim 1]

Erk. Sorry to hear about this Henny! :( Hope you get it cracked soon!

[corrado_16v 0]

Have u tryed swaping over the ht leads?? even thow ur geting a spark it might just be a realy weak one so its not doing its job proply soem sort of thing hapend to my on my valver

[Henny 0]

peteTDI, there's 12.8V to each injector with a good switched earth there when the injectors fire too as tested with my multimeter... there appears to be fuel getting into the cylinders, but how much and when I don't know... :|

 

corrado_16v, it's had a replacement set of leads, dizzy cap, rotor arm and plugs on it since it started playing up... the spark is nice and bright on all 4 cylinders, so it's definately not a spark issue...

 

Last night I attacked the car with a multimeter and some tools (always dangerous! :lol: )

 

All 4 injectors are giving exactly the same resistance when tested individually which is spot on spec. When all connected to the loom they're giving 3.8ohms which is bang on spec. I've swapped 'em over so that 1234 are now 4321.

 

Weird thing is that the fault is slightly less based on 1 and 2 only - it's still predominantly missing on 1&2, but it runs smoother than before when you take 3 or 4 off...

 

I'm gonna book it into my local trusted garage for them to do leakdown tests etc to see if they can work out WTF is going on 'cos I'm now utterly stumped, but, as I'm working on the assumption that the man from the AA actually knew how to use his compression tester, it could well still be a head gasket fault... :(

 

It's not gonna make it to Tatton at the weekend though... :(

[GazzaG60 0]

is the ECU faulty.

 

im not sure but there may be 2 injector drivers in the ECU and if 1 is down it may cause an issue.

 

ive seen subarus where they are running cold on 1 and the others make it run like ass becuase of the O2 correction. or shall i say it gets worse as the o2 trys to correct the AF by overfueling the others

 

other than that i rec u will have done all the usuals mate

 

if you need to try an ecu with a 30# injector chip in it i got mine.

[VEEDUBBED 0]

Henny,i had the same problem when i bought my third red G60,the bloke that sold me the car said that the engines got a holed piston 'cos there was no way to get the running on 4 cylinders even after changing god knows how many components.

Turned out to be a couple of faulty hyd tappets and the problem was identical to your engines,even worse when cold.

By the way,the next time you ever need a loom for the G60,pop down to your nearest car breaker and cut the injector loom off an old fiat croma,lancia thema,delta turbo,even an old fiat tempra/tipo,get some wiring conduct and there you are,i've done mine 2 years ago and never had a problem,cost?-nowt.

[Henny 0]

GazzaG60, nah, it's a single driver... only 2 wires which are then split to all 4 injectors which rules out all of that mate...

 

I've also now tried my other G60 ECU with my old (pre-CNC head) chip in it and that makes no difference... :(

 

VEEDUBBED, Tappets normally make a noise when they fail don't they? I suppose it could be that, I'll check it this weekend, thanks... 8)

 

I've stopped using second hand stuff on my engines/running gear as it's caused me too much hassle over the years and so if I can afford to replace with new, then I will, but thanks for the tip... 8)

[peteTDI 0]

i think you need to check the compression again as its looking like the headgasket or a cracked head or block i'am sorry to say. lets hope it somthing silly you overlooked like duff plugs or bad spray paton on the injectors

[Henny 0]

peteTDI, yup, that's the way I'm thinking too.... it's going into my local trusted garage soon... :(

 

If it is head gasket, then the odds are that the block will have to be scrapped as it'll be related to the heli-coiled bolt hole letting go... :(

[Lippy 0]

ah man! I hope not :(

[Henny 0]

I do have a spare block though... ;)

 

Don't think this car's dead yet... ;)