Fracking - your thoughts?

[coullstar 0]

I am intrigued to know peoples thoughts on the fracking row that has arisen and those that are now protesting.

 

Im just wondering that peoples inital reaction is and what they are basing that on.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

This would be the process of harvesting natural gas by blasting water into the earth to force it to the surface for collection, or some such?

 

What is the impact of doing this? Noise and disruption?

 

It doesn't bother me and wouldn't bother me if it were in my town either. I've put up with Network Rail and housing developers pile driving into the ground for months now, so a bit of fracking wouldn't bother me so long as it doesn't directly impact my commuting.

 

It's always the same with this stuff. National Grid announce new pylons and you get villagers picketting about it: "Bury, not Blight" etc etc. It's a proper "not in MY village" mentality but happy for them to go up elsewhere, completely oblivious to the costs and negatives of burying high tension cables. Tesco announce a new supermarket and you get people picketting about that as well, and so on.

 

These moaning gits benefit from the work being done, so why the f'ck are they moaning? If it was announced that unless we frack, there will be no gas for ANYONE, anywhere, so it NEEDS to be done, they'd have a very different attitude about it, so they can frack off :D

Edited August 19, 2013 by Kevin Bacon

[Jim 1]

This might make me sound like a bit of a hippy but.. so be it. I'm getting increasingly concerned at the rate at which corporations are able to exploit natural resources, seemingly with impunity and without any concern for outcomes which because of vast profits they're always able to pay off. You only have to look at BP, Halliburton, and all those crooks and the outcomes in the Gulf of Mexico.

 

It feels as though, in the case of fracking, simply not enough research has been made widely available / accessible by the press. I'm obviously not informed enough to know whether it's safe enough, so in the mean time in concerns me about potentially permanent damage to different layers under us, like the water table, etc. I simply don't know who to trust as you never know which piece of research has had which corporations 'sponsoring' the research.

 

I'd be more reassured if I *knew* it was safe, wasn't going to cause earthquakes, etc.

[Byrd 10]

Quite right Jim, part of our country is called the Karoo and is one of the oldest undisturbed deserts on earth, BP are now gearing up to work their way through it by forcing water and other chemicals into the ground, changing the landscape for good.......... Seems shortsighted to me, no doubt a couple of politicians will benefit!!

[coullstar 0]

Some good points. Jim I work for Halliburton and believe me I know we are not squeeky clean but the press do like to paint a picture worse than it is, much the same for the likes of BP etc.

 

The idea and technology itself has been around for a long time and there is a massive amount of this going on in the states, they are getting to the point that they may almost be self sufficient soon instead of being one of the biggest importers on the globe. The problem is in the US they have the large barron lands that this can be done on, our problem is the UK is simply too crowded. Knowing what I know I believe this is a safe practice that we have nothing to worry about. If its there we should get it out I believe but not at the cost of destroying large parts of the country.

Believe me this is the next big thing globally as they are looking to do this on a global scale in places like Australia, South Africa, Turkey, Tunisia, Ukraine and many other. China is also trying to become a major player in this. It will happen so its a point whether we start doing it here and to what extent or we get left behind. Its like anything else, the decision is how deep we get involved.

 

Oh and if you want to properly look to the future look into ice methane hydrates.

Edited August 19, 2013 by coullstar

[Jim Bowen 1]

I would love it. Hope the whole earth shakes and in the distance you see mysterious lights and loud shaking noises like a scene from war of the worlds.

[aide 0]

i take the same back road from my in laws house to the coast whenever i'm up there and a swells running, about a year ago i noticed a drilling rig and a few portacabins in a field near a small hamlet, no site signage or hint as to what they were doing, there was also a LOT of cabling running up and down the nearby roads to trucks with low slung nose box things and what i guessed were some sort of seismic monitors. being a nosey bugger i did some googling and found out it was a test site for fracking, i read the pros and cons and settled with same view as Kev, that we basically need the energy and the risks seem minimal.

 

its been a long while but i drove the same road at the weekend, for about 500m in each direction i'd say 1 out 5 trees are dead, and from what i've read mass tree loss is to be expected - if that's the damage signs on the surface, than what the hell is the damage beneath it. its caused me to question my views, and i'm still not decided, but if i lived anywhere near that site i'd be buying bottled water that's for sure.

[Byrd 10]

I would love it. Hope the whole earth shakes and in the distance you see mysterious lights and loud shaking noises like a scene from war of the worlds.

 

A few young men crept closer to the pit. A tall funnel rose, then an invisible ray of heat

leapt from man to man and there was a bright glare, as each was instantly turned to fire.

Every tree and bush became a mass of flames at the touch of this savage, unearthly

Heat Ray

[davidwort 0]

I would love it. Hope the whole earth shakes and in the distance you see mysterious lights and loud shaking noises like a scene from war of the worlds.

Are you taking medication of some sort this evening?

[Portent 0]

A few young men crept closer to the pit. A tall funnel rose, then an invisible ray of heat

leapt from man to man and there was a bright glare, as each was instantly turned to fire.

Every tree and bush became a mass of flames at the touch of this savage, unearthly

Heat Ray

 

One of my favourite books and audio books..

[coullstar 0]

Not sure on the tree loss as this happens thousands of feet underground and they have a minimum distance set to drill from the well to water table so water is safe. Companies are aware of this concern and are creating organic safe fluids that will be pumped. It will scar the landscape to start with when drilling rig in place but they should be able to hide the surface equipment that deals with the gas once the rig has buggered off.

It wont be perfect, nothing is, but I do think it should be limited to start with to understand the logistics for UK wells.

[James. 7]

Not sure on the tree loss as this happens thousands of feet underground and they have a minimum distance set to drill from the well to water table so water is safe. Companies are aware of this concern and are creating organic safe fluids that will be pumped. It will scar the landscape to start with when drilling rig in place but they should be able to hide the surface equipment that deals with the gas once the rig has buggered off.

It wont be perfect, nothing is, but I do think it should be limited to start with to understand the logistics for UK wells.

 

You've made me feel slightly more at ease, thanks. I was one of those that watched "Gasland" about three/four years ago and remember saying "thank god that doesn't go on over here". But being the realist, appreciated that this process eventually would wash up on our shores.

 

My main concern was the fracking fluid entering the eco system. But if what you say is true about organic based fluids and a maintained distance from the surrounding water table then my concerns are greatly reduced.

 

Done in the correct manner then this should not pose a massive issue for us or Mother earth. So long as it is done in the correct manner.

[coullstar 0]

Yeah that old picture always comes out of someone turning on a tap an gas coming out. That was a long time ago when there was not a lot of the current practices and limitations in place. It will not happen now.

[craigowl 0]

A documentary I saw showed fizzy water from the drinking supply. This was due to methane. It was in the US. Not sure if the water was always like that, but the local hillbillys said it wasn't until fracking happened.

 

Yesterday, or day before, I heard Germany are not going ahead with it - they are concerned about gases being forced into the groundwater on which their huge beer industry depends.

No one else hear that?

 

The thought of almost unlimited energy in the UK and not having to depend on precarious suppliers like Russia, etc is very tempting.

We need to know more, as our crowded country is too small for its inhabitants not to be affected by any negative effects the laws of physics will impose - probably irreversibly.

[Jim 1]

A documentary I saw showed fizzy water from the drinking supply. This was due to methane. It was in the US. Not sure if the water was always like that, but the local hillbillys said it wasn't until fracking happened.

 

Yesterday, or day before, I heard Germany are not going ahead with it - they are concerned about gases being forced into the groundwater on which their huge beer industry depends.

No one else hear that?

 

The thought of almost unlimited energy in the UK and not having to depend on precarious suppliers like Russia, etc is very tempting.

We need to know more, as our crowded country is too small for its inhabitants not to be affected by any negative effects the laws of physics will impose - probably irreversibly.

 

Precisely my thoughts.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Not sure on the tree loss as this happens thousands of feet underground and they have a minimum distance set to drill from the well to water table so water is safe. Companies are aware of this concern and are creating organic safe fluids that will be pumped. It will scar the landscape to start with when drilling rig in place but they should be able to hide the surface equipment that deals with the gas once the rig has buggered off.

It wont be perfect, nothing is, but I do think it should be limited to start with to understand the logistics for UK wells.

 

Exactly. It's not like an amatuer deep-drilling club has decided to aimlessly put holes in the ground and see what happens when they blast water down them. Sure, there's an element of profitting from the oil companies (and what company is in business solely for our benefit?) but they wouldn't be doing it if the gas wasn't needed. People whinge about rising energy prices and when a solution is presented to them, they still f'kin moan.

 

The thought of almost unlimited energy in the UK and not having to depend on precarious suppliers like Russia, etc is very tempting.

We need to know more, as our crowded country is too small for its inhabitants not to be affected by any negative effects the laws of physics will impose - probably irreversibly.

 

Exactly. If people want to consume gas, electricity, meat, vegetables and grain products with gay abandon, they can't complain about the methods in which they are produced. If the lobbyists have better ideas about how to feed and heat a growing population at a reasonable cost, then I'm sure the government are all ears. People's ignorance of how these products come about never ceases to amaze me. They just want to consume them and not know any more, until the fracking comes knocking on their doorstep. THEN they have all the opinions in the world about sustainability.

 

The UK is not overcrowed. Just certain pockets of it are very dense. The goverment still have a ban on greenfield developments but we all know how to stop the overcrowding problem, don't we?

[coullstar 0]

Thats the issue, you only hear about something that happened many moons ago when someone probably drilled very close to the water table. This is not the case now, its not in the oil companies interest to create any issues so they will avoid and design the wells to negate or eliminate this. You are right though all the facts need to be published on a balanced basis, it just appears to me everyone is fed the potential issues by the media without putting these into perspective.

 

There probably more potential harm from industries on the surface polluting the water table than this but we all accept that now as its regulated as this will be if it goes ahead.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

it just appears to me everyone is fed the potential issues by the media without putting these into perspective.

 

Which is all the press ever do. Their aim is to simply stir up controversy and unsettle the public with their poisonous scribings.

[craigowl 0]

Hi, Jim, your post explains, so well, too, why so many do not trust science and scientists today.

I was educated in a golden age of science - it seemed to many of us to be the best and most fascinating field to work in at that time.

No doubt we were deluded to some degree, and there will have been vested interests (probably almost entirely in the US then) but scientists in the UK and Europe seemed to be trusted and respected, with no charlatans and crooks among them - only the truth and the science (good science) mattered.

Anyway, for many of my school pals, it made science well respected and attractive to be involved in.

Typically, as in many other fields in these idealistic times (1960s), science seemed to hold the potential to address and solve so many problems for the human race. However, I can assure you, the word "environment" was probably never used in my hearing in those days. The earth was treated as a useful dustbin - so big as to be able to dilute or disperse any nasties or waste our lifestyles may create.

Now we know that was an extremely dangerous belief.

The general public have to scrabble around looking for who to believe. Unfortunately this means many are fooled into following the views of scientists who are plugging unsound/unproven theories.

 

Don't get me started on the £ tens of billions railway across a swathe of prime England for getting some business people from London to Birmingham a bit faster!

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Who's the young lady in your Avatar?

[craigowl 0]

Who's the young lady in your Avatar?

 

Nancy Ajram

Edited August 21, 2013 by craigowl

[MarkR 11]

At the moment it is a lot of fuss about nothing. As far as I am aware they are drilling for oil. A licence has not been issued to frack.

Edited August 20, 2013 by MarkR

[Henny 0]

Sorry, but the only thing I can think of when I hear about this is this:

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]75393[/ATTACH]

 

Probably an age thing.... ;)

[Jim 1]

Prescient timing on this news article..

 

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=groundwater-contamination-may-end-the-gas-fracking-boom

[Kevin Bacon 5]

I don't think many of Britain's large towns and cities use wells for drinking water though? Mostly resevoirs I thought, which are above the fracking height as I understand it?