Engine flush or not ??

[Just 1.8 16V 0]

Hi all, my 1.8 16Valver has now covered 120K and sometimes sounds a bit rattily/tapitity. I have always changed the oil within the recomended interval. Its due for an oil change this week and im not sure to use one of these engine flush products before changing the oil this time. Has anyone else tried these products??

 

Cheers

[Jim 2]

I used one on my old 16v before an oil change once, but general consensus on here is not to use it.. can cause certain seals, etc to perish in the engine.

 

The rattly / tappityness is probably just your tappits which, by 120k, is going to be quite common - and an engine flush won't cure that.

 

Either switch to a slightly thicker weight oil (15w/40 instead of the standard VAG Synta Silver which is 10w/40) or book it in for a new set of tappits :)

[Just 1.8 16V 0]

Thanks for your help, New set of tappits sounds expensive!! but if its got to be done......

[Jim 2]

Well it doesn't have to be done :) Tappets just get noisy with age; its one of those things. But I had a new set of tappets and all the belts changed at Stealth on my old 16v'er about three years ago and it cost something like £220 all in.

[Guest]

You know what is a great engine flush add-in? Automatic transmission fluid. This stuff is full of chemical detergants and is really good for cleaning junk out of the motor. I run a litre of this stuff through my motor every once in a while to clean it out. It has a lower viscosity rating so if you do use it make sure to do so a few 100 kms before the next change and avoid high speed runs on the motor ways. The lifters for the 16V are the same as most VW's including the 8V and VR6 (if they are hydraulic) to name a few so they should be cheap. You will have to pull the cams to get to them but this isn't too hard. Now, I noticed that you stated you have a 1.8 16V, don't those use solid lifters? It may be that your car needs to have the lifters adjusted by installing the correct thickness shims.

 

Cheers, Dennis

[h100vw 0]

16Vs have hydraulic tappets like all the other motors for the last 20 years or so. With maybe diesels being an exception.

Big cost if you get them from VW, about £20 each :cry: GSF do them for £6 I think. Still nearly 100 quid for a set of 16..

I often see them for sale on ebay for a lot less.

Gavin

[Supercharged 2]

You know what is a great engine flush add-in? Automatic transmission fluid.

 

I have also heard this does serious damage to VW engines, particuarly the seals and gaskets...

[Geo 0]

I wouldn't put any of that flush stuff near my engine. Modern oils all have detergents built in and should keep the engine clean enough.

[GIXXERUK 0]

i havent used it but i know a few people who swear by some stuff called wynns hydraulic valve treatment http://www.wynns.be/Products/Products/P ... raulic.htm

 

a mate went to the garage due to noisy tappets and the mechanic suggested this stuff, he said it immediately went quiet when he added it , since then a few others i know have used it , sell it in halfords

 

THIS IS NOT AN ENGINE FLUSH

[Guest]

Whether you wish to believe it or not ATF is superior to most engine flush products you will ever buy. Say that AFT damages seals is incorrect, they use the same seals in automatic transmissions as they do in motors, look at a front torque convertor seals and find the difference. Yes, all motor oils have detergants in them and they all break down with the oil and do very little. ATF is a hydraulic oil and is made to be used under high pressure and will protect friction surfaces that are as thick as a couple of pieces of paper on top of each other. ATF has better cleaning agents as ATF works under a higher load and usually has to run for 8 times the duration of motor oil. The drawback is ATF is thinner and should not be used when the car is under high load such as extended highway driving or pulling a trailor.

 

My car leaks no oil nor does it burn great amounts of oil, I never top it up between 6,000 km oil changes. I usually top up the oil with a 1/2 litre or so of ATF to fill the crank and drive the car for a couple 100 kms and then do an oil change. Sludge buildup and coating is common with oil even though it has cleaners and such built in. A buddy has a VR6 B3 Passat and I noticed a lot of staining in his motor from just changing the oil at 6,000 km intervals compared to mine using the same intervals but using some ATF every two or three changes and the difference is more than obvious. The first pic is my buddies and the second pic is from mine, notice any difference?

 

http://members.shaw.ca/vr6_corrado-2/T-Chain16.jpg

 

http://members.shaw.ca/vr6_corrado-3/VR6Tchain1.jpg

 

You can easily see the difference between these two motors, the first does have about 10,000 more kilometers on it which is not enough to stain all of that. Believe it or not, flushing the oil out is very important to the life of your motor. I have nothing to gain or lose here, I'm just sharing what I have learned working in the automotive industry for a long time.

 

Dennis

[Skimask 0]

Don't use a flush on a 16V, my tappets were quiet until I used the stuff, been noisy ever since!!

[stevemac 0]

The main problem with using engine flush on an old engine is that it tends to loosen any dirt/congealed oil inside the engine. At first thought, this sounds like a good idea. When considered more closely, it's not. These particles can & often do block oil passages, etc.

 

Engine flush is great for clean engines - to keep them clean. Once the inside of an engine becomes worn - engine flush is a disasterous idea.

 

Engine flush is a means of keeping an engine clean & not a remedy for a worn engine.

[Guest]

I beg to differ, it is very odd to see sludge build up in presurized passages. I have taken many motors apart & seen even more done by other people and it is not common to see this kind of build up unless the oil pump has been failing. Sludge and build-up usually coats parts such as valve covers and blocks breathers but rarely does it cause seals to fail or big chunks of stuff to release and end up in the oil. Even if they did they would be sucked into the oil pump and trapped in the oil filter.

 

I have seen this & done it myself on motors of different ages and conditions and not once have I witnessed a failure. When I first bought my A2 Jetta over 10 years ago it had sludge build-up that I found in the valve cover when changing a leaking gasket. I used ATF a number of times with short oil changes and this motor went on to perform flawlessly for over 150,000 kms until it met its end with over 350,000 kms. Never was the motor apart other than general maintenance and it as well did not sprout oil leaks or start burning oil like crazy.

 

Engine flushes are not means of correcting a worn motor but they will allow that motor to go much further by cleaning out contaminates that induce wear. This same theory works for flushing brake fluid and antifreeze, clean the old stuff out to get rid of dirt and contaminates that will reduce the life of your motor. I've seen the damage from not maintaining a motor and I've seen the extended life from making sure it maintained properly and I can say from my personal experience that flushing all old fluids on a regular schedule will extend the life of any car. Either way, what works for me doesn't have to work for you but it doesn't mean that it doesn't work. People were asking about engine flushes so I threw this in as many people have never heard about it.

 

In this specific situation using any engine flush will not correct this problem because it is due to mechanical wear that has already happened and the lifters need to be replaced. On my A2 I had a simlar problem when I bought it and using ATF every 12,000 - 18,000 kms corrected the lifter noise unless the car was parked for a few days. Another thing I had read a while ago was that the oil pumps on these cars or the 8 valves (I forget which) wear after a few years and it is a lack of top end oil pressure that causes this. It has been said that using the 36mm oil pump out of the Audi 2.0 4 cylinder motor used in the early 90's 80 and 90 model will also correct this without changing the lifters.

 

Dennis

[stevemac 0]

Insane_VR6, 15 years experience, working for Mercedes has taught me otherwise. I fully stand by my above comments & so do all of the experienced mechanics that I know.

[Guest]

I guess Mercedes are different from VW's, I stand by what I know and first saw this method used for noisey lifters from Volkswagen Canada in 1987. I have also seen it used by mechanics for Nissan & Mazda but I didn't ask where they heard it from. I guess we agree to disgree but after seeing this used for years and doing it on my own cars for even longer I have yet to see a problem. I know when I crack my motors open they look as clean inside as they did when they left the factory.

[Bobert healetty 0]

:offtopic1: theres still a such thing as mechanics? i thought they were called technicians now...

i know when i graduate id rather have the title of technician instead of mechanic :-P

[hardhitter 0]

Theres no substitute for regular oil changes. I wouldn't use any kind of engine fulsh, personally.