Anyone converted their 16v from k jet to digifant from a mk3

[chrismc 0]

Well i wish you all the best but saying form square one that K-jet is good for 200bhp when you only have one engine thats standard thats hit it i dont think qualifies in my book as in any old perosn out there can get 200bhp form a 9A 2L 16v

 

In the end fo the day If im still about i the scene next year ill be hunting down these cars are rolling roads etc to have a look at their figures etc and at tracks to see how they go

 

Its a standard "9A BLOCK" only! Of course the rest of the motor has been highly uprated, flowed head, highly tweaked fuelling, schrick cams with modified timing..but then Graham worked for TSR & had lots of knowledge/time to experiment!!!!

 

I have already stated that Ian & Grahams cars were an exception, with 175-185BHP being more realistic. When did I say anyone can get 200BHP from a 9A 2L 16v?

 

My own car with ITBs doesnt make 200BHP, so im hardly likely to say its a piece of p*ss on K-Jet eh??? :roll:

 

Gladly come & seek out my own or Grahams cars if you are doubtful..

[aposegil 0]

first off all it was not a direct comment to yourself so calm yourself down no need to jump and repeat same conversation been had

 

form square one the argument is, that getting 200bhp from a 9A is not easy and not achievable and two cases have been presented to the forum one with a standard bottom end the other not, ok but still doesnt proves that’s it easy to get 200bhp form a 9A with k-jet unless you put in what uve mentioned

 

I suggest you go back to the beginning and read exactly what’s been said from each person

 

im covering all the points instead of picking on each individual and breaking it down that way so sorry if youve taken it the wrong way but thats how i reply

 

and two can you present to me were i criticized yours? as far as im concern your figures etc are fine hence my comment your engine about receiving its compensation for being standard through the throttle bodies was made.

 

it that more clear?

[chrismc 0]

I dont think anyone has said its easy...

 

But, the two "exceptional" cars mentioned, HAVE done it. The 9A "block" is the only standard part of Grahams engine. Everything else is modified....

 

A standard 136BHP corrado 2L 16v with a 9A is a world away from an engine such as Ians or Grahams..

[olly elworthy 0]

ok then according to your theories and calcuations means if i get a vr lump do the cams portig exhaust fueling etc etc i should be acheiving 257bhp form N/A? and so on with every other enigne in the vw range?

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

this comment is completley stupid, :oops: ,, a VR motor is totally different,,

we are talking about 2 litre valvers here...

 

as i say I only talk of my experiences,,

[olly elworthy 0]

first off all it was not a direct comment to yourself so calm yourself down no need to jump and repeat same conversation been had

 

form square one the argument is, that getting 200bhp from a 9A is not easy and not achievable and two cases have been presented to the forum one with a standard bottom end the other not, ok but still doesnt proves that’s it easy to get 200bhp form a 9A with k-jet unless you put in what uve mentioned

 

I suggest you go back to the beginning and read exactly what’s been said from each person

 

im covering all the points instead of picking on each individual and breaking it down that way so sorry if youve taken it the wrong way but thats how i reply

 

and two can you present to me were i criticized yours? as far as im concern your figures etc are fine hence my comment your engine about receiving its compensation for being standard through the throttle bodies was made.

 

it that more clear?

 

lets get back on thread here aposegil,, :roll:

 

the thread was about converting to electronic injection from a MK3 over K jet and i said there is no point as you can fuel a 200bhp engine with K jet and you can!!! ians and grahams cars are examples of this!!! 8)

 

the rest of it has been trying to justify your quizzing about these motors,,, they do produce that power, i have told you what they are made up from case closed!!!

:roll:

[chrismc 0]

I cant be bothered with this guy anymore Olly... :brickwall:

 

Im off to get my bottom end lightened & balanced because its going to make loads more power if i do.. :notworthy:

 

Maybe it wont just be Cossies I eat for brekky at combe now... :thumb right:

[olly elworthy 0]

:brickwall:

[AS-TECHNiK 0]

I am considering this conversion but i am just wondering has anyone done it?

I am nearly certain its a plug and play conversion

 

Right,,,,back to the point of this topic,

 

There is nothing stopping you from performing the conversion to mk3 loom. to make your life easier it would be far easier to have a donor mk3 valver to enable you to just simply transfer everything you need. I think this will also include the ignition barrel which forms part of the immobiliser circuit (i believe).

 

Personally for the cost and hassle i definitly wouldnt bother. Think long term! Go Megasquirt.

 

http://www.megasquirt.info

 

Unless u can get the mk3 stuff for free, for the cost of a Megasquirt you could easily ditch the K-jet and ignition control module and have a fully mappable standalone system on the car that you can tune to suit any future modifications (including Turbocharging).

 

This way you can put an end to any arguing ive seen here and know that at some point you will be able to have 200hp with your 9A.

[aposegil 0]

ok then according to your theories and calcuations means if i get a vr lump do the cams portig exhaust fueling etc etc i should be acheiving 257bhp form N/A? and so on with every other enigne in the vw range?

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

this comment is completley stupid, :oops: ,, a VR motor is totally different,,

we are talking about 2 litre valvers here...

 

as i say I only talk of my experiences,,

 

how’s my comments stupid you guys make a suggestion that a 47% increase of power over standard so a vr with your same theory should make 257bhp taking into account any variance (i.e yes I’m quoting low just in case it cant make it) and I cant see how it would be different your only playing with exhaust cams and porting and all vw engines are well balanced and can rev high and we all know a Vr behaves very similar to a 16v rather than a true v engine

 

also in the end of the day it was you guys that presented that you can get 200bhp from k jet which RMN original question was how much work is it to put the mkIII loom but as your first comments were "why bother u can get 200bhp from k-jet" that’s what’s sparked this off and as with determined from this you cant get this 2000bhp without a lot of work which makes it all pointless and you guys gladly proven it

 

so before u get all smart and say I cant be bothered with this guy how about you rethink your comments, I’ve proven you cant make 200bhp and uve guys agreed with me, without doing the work revving over factory specs isn’t clever and balancing etc will make smoother better power

 

but I guess you guys have it all sussed out how to do it so here’s my advise as you clearly already made yours and I really think your onto something here start your own company advertise to as many people that run k-jet porsches, vw and fords (mercs and Volvos if u fancy but not that huge on the modding scene) and promise them great performance figures but do something for me promise them its going to be a standard engine ;) wouldn’t want you to over charge them for any extra work ;)

 

AS-TECHNiK – i agree heard good things about megasquirt and knew someone running before on a 16v and didn’t run bad but my point form the beginning as RMN is getting all the mkIII bits is that he will get more out of that than the k-jet as standard

[flusted 0]

I think the point to be made now would be,say you fit your abf,then mod it (cams head etc) Then get it tuned and dynod with k-jet.Then convert from kjet to digipants,get it mapped will you make more power for the expense of the time,money and labour for the bits.

Also abf injectors arent easily upgraded as they are a stumpy design

IMO I cant see if i converted to abf digi, how i would gain anymore power over my existing set up,which is basically what the topic is asking!

 

(Might be my fault about the 200bhp k-jetters comment :oops: )

[davidwort 0]

I think the point to be made now would be,say you fit your abf,then mod it (cams head etc) Then get it tuned and dynod with k-jet.Then convert from kjet to digipants,get it mapped will you make more power for the expense of the time,money and labour for the bits.

Also abf injectors arent easily upgraded as they are a stumpy design

IMO I cant see if i converted to abf digi, how i would gain anymore power over my existing set up,which is basically what the topic is asking!

 

(Might be my fault about the 200bhp k-jetters comment :oops: )

 

Isn't the point that standard 16v K-jet can deliver the air and fuel for 200+ bhp, with not much more than a tweak to the control pressure, which is great for us amateur engine builders, it's cheap and effective :)

You can't dispute this Alex.

So that makes it pretty pointless going to the expense and effort of changing to another system unless you want to get every last bit of power from a heavily modified engine.

I believe the 16v head has the flow potential for 250bhp in NA form, but I don't think the K-jet air flap and inlet will deliver this. Forced induction probably would.

As far as the VR goes, it's a terrible head, the inlet runners are different lengths for gods sake! why do you think VW went to the 24V head, basically everyone else was getting closer to 240 bhp from their V6's and the original VR6 design just didn't cut it, the only big power Vr6's are forced induction which as we all know is cheating :wink:

 

anyway, back to the point,

not much dosh = stick with K-jet on a modded 16v

money to burn = throttle bodies and mappable ECU :wink: :)

aquire whole ABF with loom etc = have a go with the VW system, but re-mapping won't be cheap, probably pay for your flowed head!

 

David.

[rmn 0]

@flusted so your the trouble maker! :lol:

 

I think the solution is as you said, for ease(and cos i still have not collected the abf engine loom) i will pop in the engine with the k jet and do some modding, and headwork too. then get it setup and dyno'd

then in january or so i will fire in the electronic injection and get it mapped.

Then we will see what the same setup on both will be like :lol:

[chrismc 0]

 

Isn't the point that standard 16v K-jet can deliver the air and fuel for 200+ bhp, with not much more than a tweak to the control pressure, which is great for us amateur engine builders, it's cheap and effective :)

You can't dispute this Alex.

So that makes it pretty pointless going to the expense and effort of changing to another system unless you want to get every last bit of power from a heavily modified engine.

I believe the 16v head has the flow potential for 250bhp in NA form, but I don't think the K-jet air flap and inlet will deliver this. Forced induction probably would.

As far as the VR goes, it's a terrible head, the inlet runners are different lengths for gods sake! why do you think VW went to the 24V head, basically everyone else was getting closer to 240 bhp from their V6's and the original VR6 design just didn't cut it, the only big power Vr6's are forced induction which as we all know is cheating :wink:

 

anyway, back to the point,

not much dosh = stick with K-jet on a modded 16v

money to burn = throttle bodies and mappable ECU :wink: :)

aquire whole ABF with loom etc = have a go with the VW system, but re-mapping won't be cheap, probably pay for your flowed head!

 

David.

 

Thank you David, that was exactly the point...

 

200BHP has been achieved with good old K-Jet, regardless of modded/non-modded blocks etc etc so it is Do-able

 

A digifant fuelled car will also need exactly the same level of work (with the possible addition of bigger injectors/mapping) to achieve the same...No real point IMO

 

The easier option is to go megasquirt/ITBs....

 

Whilst the ITBS have shown not to give any additional power as things stand on my car (over similar spec K-jets) it has superior throttle response, never goes out of tune etc etc...

 

With higher compression, solid lifter head, & steel bottom end the ITBs will come into their own...220+BHP......which the K-Jet wont fuel for

[rmn 0]

With higher compression, solid lifter head, & steel bottom end the ITBs will come into their own...220+BHP......which the K-Jet wont fuel for

thats the ideal 16v setup, VW motorsports last of the line mk3 ABF kit cars ran up to 280 bhp in that configuration on motronic