How to strip a PAS rack?

[boost monkey 0]

Hi team,

 

So i'm rebuilding this rack off the scrapper shell, and I've got this far:

 

pasrack.JPG[/attachment:60twgle9]

 

Does anyone know if I can seperate it down further than this or is it not worth it? I really want to clean all the gunk out of it (majority of threaded holes have dirt in them too).

 

I know the seal on the splined bit at the top is an easy swap, but I also know that VAG sell a "set of PAS seals" which I've ordered but I don't know where they go, as the top seal is a separate part.

 

Also, does anyone know if it's safe to wash / submerge the rack as it is into some water with de-greaser or muck removal stuff? I'd be leaving it to dry before rebuilding so hopefully none of the hydraulics would be compromised.

 

Expertise welcome!

[boost monkey 0]

11 views and no interest?

 

I'm starting to feel like Channel 5.

[davidwort 0]

if the rack is actually leaking fluid then new seals are obviously a good idea, otherwise I'd leave it alone, if the rack is slightly worn, especially in the straight ahead position, then it'll always feel a bit vague, (not that they ever seem to wear excessively) they usually get like this after 100K or so, only real cure is a brand new rack or a low mileage one, re-con racks are basically what you're trying to do, an old one checked for excessive wear and then new seals fitted, OK for an old hack but not what you'd ideally want on a Corrado.

[boost monkey 0]

Thanks david,

 

do you know which seals are replaced? As mentioned, I've ordered some but i'm not sure where they go! :?

 

there doesn't seem to be much play in it at all and it definitely wasn't leaking before being removed... the one currently on the corrado has leaked itself dry and taken the pump with it, I fear.

[boost monkey 0]

Going back to what you said about wearing excessively, I cannot find a single mm of wear on any of the moving parts of this rack.

 

None of the parts have travel in them at all, they all move with respect to each other at the correct time when asked to.

 

Only thing I can think which would have play in would be rod ends as they obviously have hemispherical movement, although these should only start to move freely when they are wearing outas you mentioned.

[davidwort 0]

Going back to what you said about wearing excessively, I cannot find a single mm of wear on any of the moving parts of this rack.

 

None of the parts have travel in them at all, they all move with respect to each other at the correct time when asked to.

 

Only thing I can think which would have play in would be rod ends as they obviously have hemispherical movement, although these should only start to move freely when they are wearing outas you mentioned.

 

I don't think the racks themselves actually wear much really, it's usually other components like inner track rod joints that feel like they are the rack.

But, play and feel under steering loads can be very different to any play you might be able to detect with parts off the car.

I reckon it stands to reason that the centre part of the rack, and just a few mm either side where you steering is positioned 99% of the time, will show some wear over the years, even if it's not really visible in the parts and not felt with the bits off the car.

The problem with recon racks is that parts like that are pretty much always 'within tolerance' so just get reused.

It's the addition of tiny amounts of play in the UJ, rack, inner joints, outer joints, bearings and bushings that all add up.

I've replaced just about everything apart from the rack and UJ, and although they don't show any play moved by hand there is still a bit of vagueness in the 'straight-ahead' position. Miles better though after I replaced the whole track rods, interestingly, the 150K ends were solid-as, it was the inner joints that had clonking movement in them.

[boost monkey 0]

Cumulative errors, I hear you! Very interesting, and I do concur that a lot of wear from parts under load won't be able to be duplicated off the car due to the high loads involved (at least repectively, considering the small loads a hand can apply!)

 

The rack on the car atm is horrible, it darts left and right all the time and I always keeps the tires pumped up. I recall that the knuckle in the U/J had LOADS of play in on my golf, which resulted in that feeling where you turn the wheel 10-20 degrees either way from centre and the wheels don't move! :shock: scary stuff.

 

I am just waiting for some more parts to come in to start rebuilding the rack, but the old rods on this one did look quite past it indeed.

[dutchboy 0]

I'm about to crack on with this job as well. Let me know how you get on mate.

[coolrado 0]

have you tried nipping up the pinch bolt at the base of the lower steering column U/J.

My car failed its MOT on what the garage was adamant was a knackered steering rack, causing a slack spot in the steering, the bolt took a whole turn before it was properly tight and sorted the problem out straight away, my rack now has 145k on it and still no slack, i have found the same problem on my caddy van and on two of my friends mk2 golf's.

allways worth checking.

[boost monkey 0]

have you tried nipping up the pinch bolt at the base of the lower steering column U/J.

My car failed its MOT on what the garage was adamant was a knackered steering rack, causing a slack spot in the steering, the bolt took a whole turn before it was properly tight and sorted the problem out straight away, my rack now has 145k on it and still no slack, i have found the same problem on my caddy van and on two of my friends mk2 golf's.

allways worth checking.

 

Yeah, definitely worth checking, that came out on my golf! :shock: :shock: The steering wheel happily span 360 degrees! Luckily it was just in the footwell. I will check that today at some point. When I put it back in on my golf, i used some thread lock which seemed to do the trick.

 

Looks like I might have a spare rebuilt rack then! ha ha.

 

Cheers.

[boost monkey 0]

btw, if people WERE thinking of stripping it down further, there is a circlip which holds in the top splined steering drive.

 

I'm not sure if i will remove this. If my set of PAS seals comes with a replacement circlip, then I will probably give it a go.

[poll250 0]

What do you need to 'nip the bolt up on the UJ? I remember having mine apart last year and there didn't seem to be anything to do up?

 

edit:

 

Just found this pic from a topic I made last year! Anyone point out which bit I should be able to tighten?

 

[boost monkey 0]

on my golf, it was a 10mm bolt around 25mm long with a nut on one end and a bullet-type 10mm head on the other.

 

On the spare U/J outside, it looks like a plain 13mm bolt, same length.

 

It's quite a long way up behind the dash. I currently have my under-steering-wheel plastic panel in and you can't see the bolt without removing this.

 

Can take pics if need be.

[poll250 0]

Woah that was quick!

 

Mine has a lot more free play in the middle wheel position then the top one, at mot last year I just stuck it in the highest setting and removed the adjuster leaver so they couldnt fail it!

 

Should really try and sort it this year though!

[boost monkey 0]

That's way too far up the steering column mate,

 

the U/J is the part that goes from the bottom of the steering column (just above the pedals) through the bulkhead to the steering rack on the subframe. It's just a knuckle joint really.

 

I have a spare complete column outside, I'll go snap it with my phone :D

[coolrado 0]

There are two Universal joints on the column, one down at the bottom by the pedals and another at the top where the adjustable steering column hinge is, the bottom one is the one that comes loose and can be tightened up with the pinch bolt, the top one is part of the column and cannot come loose(apart from wear in the u/j).

 

it looks like the problem poll250 is describing is a loose steering wheel height adjusting mechanism which isnt to do with the u/j's, which will either be down to a loose pin that the mechanism teeth latch onto or just a worn out mechanism(usually worn or bent teeth).

 

i'm sure it could be tightened up a bit with a bit of messing around though.

[boost monkey 0]

Ok, so this is the full rack:

 

climatronic wiring-Golf from May 01.pdfcolumn1.JPG[/attachment:zrajree3]

 

let's look closer at the join about 1/3 in from the right:

 

2.8l 24v Climatronic system.pdfcolumn2.JPG[/attachment:zrajree3]

 

This is the 13mm bolt (sorry, thought it was a 10!) that you need to tighten...see the end of the steering column is splined and slips into it? You are tightening this join.

 

let's rotate the column and zoom in a bit more (aka blurry mess on my phone!):

 

column3.JPG[/attachment:zrajree3]

 

 

So that's the one you need to do up a bit if it's loose. As mentioned mine came off before and my whole steering wheel span freely on it's bearings!! Luckily I was only pulling into a car park, but could have been very dangerous.

 

hth,

 

Jon.

 

p.s. if you still can't find it, pop round! :lol:

[boost monkey 0]

There are two Universal joints on the column, one down at the bottom by the pedals and another at the top where the adjustable steering column hinge is.

 

it looks like the problem poll250 is describing is a loose steering wheel height adjusting mechanism which isnt to do with the u/j's, which will either be down to a loose pin that the mechanism teeth latch onto or just a worn out mechanism(usually worn or bent teeth).

 

i'm sure it could be tightened up a bit with a bit of messing around though.

 

Oh..... completely disregard my last post then :(

 

*sigh*

[poll250 0]

Ace!

[boost monkey 0]

Ace!

 

My velcros? Thanks. They're mail-order don't you know 8)

[poll250 0]

hahah yeap nice velcros indeed!

 

Ill have a little tinker after work and see what I can see! Thanks for the pics Jon!

 

Andy

[poll250 0]

Quick update - did the 13mm bolt up at the bottom near the pedals, and the wobbling is a lot better now :)

There's no side-to-side wobble anymore, just some up-and-down.

 

That is definitely in the top UJ, does anyone know of any way to tighten the top UJ up?

[boost monkey 0]

Quick update - did the 13mm bolt up at the bottom near the pedals, and the wobbling is a lot better now :)

There's no side-to-side wobble anymore, just some up-and-down.

 

That is definitely in the top UJ, does anyone know of any way to tighten the top UJ up?

 

Awesome! did you manage to do it without removing any of the under-dash plastic panels? I can't be bothered to take mine off again, but this whole bolt thing has got me paranoid!

 

I think coolrado touched on the upper U/J at the top of thie page, sorry I forgot to quote it!

[coolrado 0]

yeah the up and down wobble wont be the top uj it will be the height adjuster mechanism, there is a little hardened steel pin that sometimes comes loose or falls out altogether, if the pin is ok and still there it will just be worn teeth on the mechanism.

[boost monkey 0]

Poll250,

 

if you find out your teeth are worn (like an OAP :lol: ) you can have my spare steering column, I only need it for the U/J at the bottom :wink: :thumb right:

 

Does mean you'll have to pop over to studentland though.... you've had your tetanus recently right?