vr6 engine rebuild

[sim0n_parker 0]

right, im going to be getting the engine soon and want to do the research on to what parts etc to buy,

im looking at putting new chains and tensioners and guides on aswell as head gasket etc, can i buy the locking tools? and is there any guides on how to tim them up? i have autodata but it doesnt give you a good guide it just shows a few pics thats it.

 

also once its all timed up etc is it just a case of flciking the key to start it or any precodure to prime the system with oil first? do i have to prime the chain tensioners somehow?

 

i wouldnt mind putting cams in whilst im there but any good websites? groupbuys coming up within a month or so?

 

engine has done 133,000 miles, might get the head looked at whilst its of.

 

any info and links to sites would be gladly appreciated, had a flick thought the searchs but couldnt find a great deal, and the wiki is down at the mo.

cheers guys

simon

[easypops 8]

Here is a good link for the chains etc........originally posted by peanut

 

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1264409

[___Dubstar___ 0]

Much like Mr Parker above, except I am replacing my shattered lump with a replacement one I would like some guidance on which bits to replace/improve/inspect while its all out of the car. The engine that has been destroyed had only just had the chains and tensioners replaced 200 miles before an over tightened screw on my Schrick VSR manifold sheared and shot into the manifold and then the engine whilst cruising at "just about 70 mph, officer" - you can imagine the rest. So now i have a knackered "future proofed" engine that was mint with new chains and tensioners as well as a soon to be mine 100k mile well looked after lump (supposedly) to replace it.

 

I have read the amazing replacement chain thread and will probably salvage the nearly new set from the old engine to put in the new replacement one but what other jobs do you recommend doing whilst the whole thing is out of the car?? - Obviously it will get a full service and clean, do i skim the head etc etc etc

 

Any low cost improvements would be welcome - it’s taken 2 years to muster the courage to get back to fixing the car after that horrific day! I don’t need another £2000 bill to put right the original "improvements" I need the VR6 back in my life!

 

Thanks

 

Ian

[floppyman 0]

If the head is coming out have a look at the valve guides.

The tool to.lock the camshafts comes with some aftermarket camshafts, but you can buy them very cheap.... Or if you want you can make one pretty easy.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

There are about 4 or 5 VR6 rebuild discussions going on at the moment, so can we please keep duplicates to a minimum?! :D

[___Dubstar___ 0]

Many thanks "floppyman" for the input - much appreciated, and to "FishWick" my sincerest apologies - this was the only VR6 rebuild thread that appeared on my search - it led me to the chain thread and no more. My mistake, im sure when I find all the other VR6 threads they will answer all my questions. Please disregard my previous comments. I can appreciate how much of an inconvenience duplicate threads must be (one of the main reasons I didnt start my own) as well as how much of a premium space must be on this forum.

 

Thank you for taking the time to point out the error of my ways (smiley face)

[lukeyy 10]

doing same thing man, tired stem seals, so gonna rebuild the entire thing, sourced a completely overhauled head, so just looking at finding another bottom end now and putting low con rods and pistons so its ready for turbo'ing. ;)

 

keep me updated on how yours is going man, nice to know that theres other people going through the same. lol

[VW_OwneR_85 1]

luckily my corrado vr6 i brought {engine wise} has been spot on! has 130k on the clock, uses no oil,no coolant and is prety smooth now i got a new exhaust system, chains n guides could do with being done{slight noise from them not bad tho} even though i think the top half has been done at some point as theres blue sealant seeping out the case join, iv seen all the how to guides etc doesnt look to bad tbh,but would be cool to see how others get on with it,if you could some pics up if you start it that woud be sweet!

[___Dubstar___ 0]

Ok, I’ve spent the last few days searching for info on VR6 rebuilds and there are still a few unanswered questions plus I can only find one other thread started by "lukeyy" on 2nd July 2011. So I’m going to high jack this one (rather than start another thread) to hopefully find some answers and get me back on the road. I’ve read through lots of posts and the very detailed sticky on chains and tensioners. I’ve come up with a short list of what I should or could change. Luckily the thousands of pounds I’ve spent on parts at my VW dealer in the last 14 years is paying dividend as my parts guy has got their “master technician” to write me a list of parts with numbers and prices for bits that may need looking at – its win win for them as I will be spending money with them whatever I do!

 

I would also be grateful for any other pointers - does anyone know if there is an exploded diagram/schematic of the VR6 on here? I'm planning on changing all seals and gaskets - is there a definitive list? Is it worth replacing the oil pump (or at least “oil pump drive gears” – whatever they are?) and water pump etc - is wear easily detectable to these parts and others?

 

I'll be transferring the new tappets, chains and tensioners from my old engine so that’s one cost saving at least.

 

I’ve identified the following torque settings from the chains sticky;

“Install the ten (10) bolts that secure the cover to the head and the lower timing chain cover. Torque the eight (8) 5mm hex bolts to 89 in-lbs (10 N-m) and the two (2) 6mm hex bolts to 18 ft-lbs (25 N-m). NOTE: Make sure to tighten the two (2) upper cover-to-lower cover bolts (red arrows in Step 12) before tightening the eight (8) upper cover-to-head bolts or the seal between the upper and lower covers may leak.

52. Remove the upper tensioner bolt from the container of oil, wipe it off and then install it in the rear edge of the upper timing chain cover. Torque to the bolt to 22 ft-lbs (30 N-m). (Note: The MKIV Bentley gives conflicting values for the tensioner bolt torque. In multiple places it lists it as 22 ft-lbs (30 N-m), but in one place it lists it at 30 ft-lbs (40 N-m). I'm not sure which one is actually correct, but either one would probably be OK. I torqued mine to 22 ft-lbs and have not had any problems.)

53. Remove the cam locking tool (or plate(s)) from the grooves in the end of the camshafts.

54. Reinstall spark plugs and torque to 18 ft-lbs (25 N-m).

55. Reinstall valve cover (make sure the valve cover seal fits correctly) and torque the ten (10) captured bolt or nuts to 89 in-lbs (10 N-m). “

 

As we will be stripping the whole engine what other torque settings are there?

 

And then there’s the valve stem seals/guides – what is their true title, are seals and guides 2 separate things?? Either way they seem to be major culprits for poor running from all the threads ive read (and ive read a lot!!) so I might as well replace them while its all apart and the credit card is smoking. Is this the same as “Classic valve guide wear symptoms.” As Fishwick has referred to it previously?

 

I found this;

 

“If the head has done 140K, chances are the guides may need replacing, so check for valve rock when the head is off. Just putting new seals over worn guides will put you back to square one again after a few hundred miles……..”

 

I hope I don’t come across as a “tell me how to fix my car – I cnat be bothered to work it out” sort of person but I have little or no mechanical knowledge and I’m starting a bit late in life but I will be doing all this myself with the help of a more knowledgeable VW enthusiast.

 

This forum is an amazing resource and I truly appreciate every contribution, I have been a member for some time but as I have had very few problems and such little knowledge I haven’t been able to contribute as I should but hopefully that will all change now. I will be taking lots of pics and making detailed notes. From my trawling of the posts there doesn’t seem to be a definitive VR6 rebuild guide for general servicing and over hauls so maybe this could be the start of something to help people in the future – as has been mentioned before most of the VR’s out there are getting on in the mileage stakes and this will affect all of them at some stage no doubt.

 

Sermon over………

[___Dubstar___ 0]

http://www.wagenstad.com/index.php?model=cor

 

ive solved the parts/diagram issue with the above - i'm guessing its just the ETKA pages reproduced?

[___Dubstar___ 0]

looks like ill be going this one alone then!

[Kevin Bacon 5]

As we will be stripping the whole engine what other torque settings are there?

 

Have you read the 2 part chains guide in the wiki mate? It's all in there ;)

 

And then there’s the valve stem seals/guides – what is their true title, are seals and guides 2 separate things?? Either way they seem to be major culprits for poor running from all the threads ive read (and ive read a lot!!) so I might as well replace them while its all apart and the credit card is smoking. Is this the same as “Classic valve guide wear symptoms.” As Fishwick has referred to it previously?

 

I found this;

 

“If the head has done 140K, chances are the guides may need replacing, so check for valve rock when the head is off. Just putting new seals over worn guides will put you back to square one again after a few hundred miles……..”

 

Indeed. You generally find more play on the exhaust guides due to the heat they endure but VW's tolerance for guide wear is 1mm. That is to say, grab the end of a fully open valve (by turning the camshaft - 24mm open end spanner required) and try and move it. If it wobbles around like a good un, the guides are fecked. A tiny amount of movement is acceptable and not worth bothering with. The exhaust valves will probably benefit from a grind. Google "valve grinding" to see what's involved. You'll need a half decent spring compressor like this - http://www.lasertools.co.uk/item.aspx?cat=0&item=1402

 

Yep the guides and seals are seperate items. I would only use VAG viton seals VAG guides personally. The guides need to be pressed in and you can get a tool to do that, from VW funnily enough. Guide fitment is easier if the head is baked in the oven and the guides are frozen, but the guides have been revised to include a 'lip', so you can't knock them in too far :D Then finally the guides need to be reamed out to 7mm and again, VW sell the tool to do that. Obviously a machine shop can do all this for you if it sounds too daunting. Prepare to smoke that credit card even more though.

 

 

I hope I don’t come across as a “tell me how to fix my car – I cnat be bothered to work it out” sort of person but I have little or no mechanical knowledge and I’m starting a bit late in life but I will be doing all this myself with the help of a more knowledgeable VW enthusiast.

 

We all have to start somewhere but 9.5 times in 10, Google will direct you to the answer!

Edited July 13, 2011 by Kevin Bacon

[___Dubstar___ 0]

I typed Google into Google and nearly broke the internet..........................................

 

Thanks for the reply FishWick - are you the sole VR6 contributor!!??

 

Is the 2 part chains guide the "sticky" or is the wicki Wikipedia? I did wiki vr6 but only saw a pic - am i missing something?

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Plenty of folk on here know the VR6, but I think I'm the only one who can be bothered to type to be honest :D

 

The full timing chain guide, courtesy of Mr 2CC. If anything's missing or you're unsure about something, just shout.

 

Part 1 - http://wiki.the-corrado.net/vr6_clutch_and_timing_chains_replacement_part_1.html

Part 2 - http://wiki.the-corrado.net/vr6_clutch_and_timing_chains_replacement_part_2.html

 

I have a VR6 lump on the engine stand at the moment, just doing the chains on it, so can take any pics you need. It's p1ss easy :D

[floppyman 0]

There are about 4 or 5 VR6 rebuild discussions going on at the moment, so can we please keep duplicates to a minimum?! :D

 

Sorry fishwick, those were your words :)