EBC front discs - Warped!

[Critical_Mass 10]

Hi all,

 

Just need some advice.

 

Bought a set of front EBC plain discs along with a set of greenstuff pads to go with them. Up until about a week ago i noticed severe vibrations through the steering wheel when braking. BUT it only seems to happen at higher speeds. I first noticed it on the motorway doing 70mph when cars ahead started to slow so i had to brake harder then normal on the motorway down to about 50mph. But when i did the steering wheel shook violently. They also seem to squeak when braking at lower speeds

 

They have only covered about 5000 miles and 6 months. So I emailed the company i bought them from who forwarded a link for me to fill out a warrenty. EBC got back to me stating i had to travel all the way to northampton to get the discs skimmed for free to correct th run out- even though i would have had to spend the cash on petrol to get there and back.

 

I was told the problem i have affects 1 in 7 cars. I suggested replacing the discs and they said they wouldnt as "new discs will not solve the problem", but surely if it was 1 in 7 cars affected id be really unlucky to get another set that was the same. Ive never known to have to skim new discs to get them run out correct??? Also they were fine up until the last week.

 

I was also told by EBC that discs NEVER warp just get thinner in places but skimming would sort that out.

 

Anyway after playing email tennis the bloke at EBC said he will send out some new discs but he said and i quote "I will send some new discs out but when it happens again in 5000 miles dont ask again".

 

Ive read on here plenty of times about EBC discs warping, but he assured me they NEVER do. THough my mechanic disagrees and says it sounds like he's trying to avoid sending new ones out .

 

Was he trying to fob me off?

[dukest 0]

1 in 7 warp? a 14% fail rate sounds pretty terrible to me and quite a high possibility it would happen again. still, if they're going to be replaced then fingers crossed for next time. just bed them in carefully (although theoretically you should be doing this with new pads too..)

[Critical_Mass 10]

1 in 7 warp? a 14% fail rate sounds pretty terrible to me and quite a high possibility it would happen again. still, if they're going to be replaced then fingers crossed for next time. just bed them in carefully (although theoretically you should be doing this with new pads too..)

 

Should i not use the current pads??

 

I told the bloke that if it happens again im only back where i am now. I dont fancy having to spend cash on more discs considering how little these have been used. :gag:

 

No he said 1 in 7 need to be skimmed for the run out :shrug: ive only just learnt what "run out" is to be honest. But its the first time ive known new discs to be skimmed to get them to fit the car right. Apparently Porshe and Jaguar agree with them [EBC Brakes] and are know to skim new discs.

 

To be honest i dont know what to make of all this. I assumed id tell them they're warped and they'd request me to send them the discs to confirm. Then they'd send me some new ones. Maybe a little naive.

[Supercharged 2]

EBC stuff is rubbish and it's not worth getting Discs skimmed in the sizes we buy as they are so cheap.

 

I would stick to your guns - get a replacement set out of them and sell them on eBay. Then buy a new pair from VAG - will last 80-100K miles easily.

[Supercharged 2]

Infact - post the email up from EBC - that sounds complete rubbish to me, hopefully put other people off buying their discs and pads!

[Guest]

I don't know what disks were on my 'new' 8v and although they were fine back in Dec when I bought the car after that winter of snow and having had a few caliper problems the fronts were definitely warped.

(rear caliper certainly seized though the front ones didn't except maybe a little frozen in the snow).

 

Kip has fitted new VAG all round and taking the fronts off they were definitely not vag.

Wouldn't bother with anything else other than VAG is using VAG brake set ups.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

I was also told by EBC that discs NEVER warp just get thinner in places but skimming would sort that out.

 

:lol:

 

Discs are only "thinner in places" if they weren't made properly in the first place.

 

Discs can and do warp. Usually caused by excessive heat and / or poor quality materials.

 

Some car dealers can and do skim discs after they've 'settled' on new cars if the customer complains of steering judder, but only on decent setups that have expensive discs, otherwise it's more cost effective to just stick a new disc on.

 

I hate to say it, but it's another example of "you get what you pay for" :D

[fla 9]

EBC discs aren't cheap though ar tehy? I thought they were about £100 for the fronts for a VR?

[Critical_Mass 10]

Yeah the discs werent cheap, they were about £80-90 quid. I always thought EBC were good, hence i went for them... even after reading the 'brake discussion' thread :lol: :?

 

Here is the game of email tennis. Apologise if its a little bit too long, but i wanted you to see how rude the bloke who is the CEO of EBC brakes actually got, he even threatened to change electricity companies because he saw i was emailing from my work email as their daft system doesnt like Yahoo mail - just for the record he wasnt supplied by my company any as i had checked. silly fool

 

Blue is my response, red is the CEO - oh and read from bottom to top :lol: sorry thats how i pasted it.

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Rudeness eh ?????

 

I think that is only encouraged by pedanticity on your part and your garages wanting things like a crying spoilt child because you think you know more.

 

You are the last one I will ever bend over backwards like this for because look what it got me.

 

The discs are on the way

 

Enjoy and throw the others in the bin, I wont waste more time proving myself right and you wrong because you wont believe me anyway

 

We USED TO USE ******* for a few hundred grand of electricity, now looking for a new supplier

 

Andy

 

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Good Morning Andy,

 

My address is -

 

 

Make - Volkswagen

 

Model - Corrado VR6 (5 stud)

 

Year - 1993

 

I will get the discs removed ready to be picked up in 7 days time (7th July), do i need to put any form labels on the package or will your courier provide them?

 

I will look forward to the report and i will indeed show it to my garage. But i think you undermine the garage i go to, its not some run of the mill "Kwik-fit", he's been in the business for many years and is indeed well experienced and knowledgeable. I will also report back in 5000 miles or sooner and let you know if this happens again.

 

Thank you for your effort and thank you for your rudeness (Im sure there's a record of your own there).

 

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Please send your address and for sake of ending this saga I will send new discs and will also send a call tag for collection of the removed discs in seven days time.

 

I will then have these analysed and send you a report which I will ask you to hand to your fitting garage.

 

I want you to know ebcbrakesdirect are an independent, they have permission to use our name but are NOTHING to do with EBC as a Company and we therefore have no control over their website. Similarly all but one “Resume” page which I will now add to our own website has all the detail in the world with videos and testimonials showing you what you car has suffered and needs.

 

You only have to hit a pothole or nudge a kerb and this happens, garages just have NO IDEA about this problem and when they do finally take the correction routine on board they buy a Pro Cut machine, which over 100,000 installers around the world have done including every Porsche,Jaguar,Honda,BMW,Ferrair and even VW as attached here.

 

This is not a new thing and EBC Brakes is not dodging any responsibility here, merely trying to help its customers get a permanent solution to a car defect.

 

http://www.procutusa.com/pdf/vw_tb_46-07-03.pdf

 

EBC inspect every disc it sells ONE BY ONE, we are the only company in the world to do it, we have NEVER sold a faulty or bent disc and as anyone with an ounce of metallurgical knowledge will tell you, thick cast iron brake discs do NOT warp. Indeed it is almost impossible that the machines we use can produce bent p4roduycts, they are accurate to within microns and if one disc is wrong they are all wrong, which is covered by the inspection.

 

I am today amending our own website with a clear and non negotiable policy on how to handle this in the future so smile as you are now in the Guinness book of records as the last customer to ever get a set f free discs from EBC for a reason that is not a product fault.

 

 

Regards Andy Freeman

 

I need

 

 

1) Your full address

 

2) Full make model and year details of your car

 

Thanks

 

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The only issue for me is being expected to travel all the way to Northampton. I dont think you realise how much it will cost me to just get to and from Northampton! It will be close to another set of discs.

 

Yes i would like you to send me some more discs, IF it happens again then im just back where i am now anyway!

 

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You ate not getting the pint gareth

 

The discs have to done on the car

 

If you wish I WILL send new discs but when this happens again in 5000 miles do not ask again.

 

This problem will return but to be honest I cannot go on arguing and arguing

 

Everything that needs saying is said on our website and by the way http://www.ebcbrakesdirect. Is an independent not controlled by us at all.

 

Sent by I phone with best regards from Andy Freeman

 

CEO EBC Brakes

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I can assure you this is a trusted garage, with years of experience and he does know what he is talking about.

 

However, arguing who is wrong or not will not resolve this issue. But i do implore you to make the information regarding possibly having to get the discs skimmed available on the 'check out' page when a customer purchases as i was NEVER aware of this until you pointed it out - this is not to insult you or your website, merely a feedback for improvement.

 

The only thing i can suggest is i remove the discs and send them down to you with a quick turn around (as my car is used daily), as i hope you understand a 5-6 hour drive round trip in a thirsty VR6 will cost a fair amount, to just get some discs skimmed. Would you agree to me removing the discs and you arranging courier both ways? I do not feel this should cost me any money.

 

Thanks.

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I am sorry buy everything you and your mechanic have said us wrong with due respect

Discs NEVER warp they only develop thin spots due to runout and that is what causes the vibration

 

The pro cut machine takes off four rhousandths whoch is tiny All discs will stand 10-20 times this reduction

 

All the top car manufacturers agree with us jaguar Porsche Honda. The list is endless

 

We are a fitting station and fit brakes for a living. You can rely on what I am saying here. Often when fitting new discs there are runout issues. Many car makers skim BRAND new discs as part of the install. Garages who have little brake knowledge are unfortunately unaware

 

We do not change our policy based on millions of unit sales and thousands of installs just because one small garage disagrees. Please indestand that and let's get your discs corrected. Thanks

 

Sent by I phone with best regards from Andy Freeman

 

CEO EBC Brakes

 

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Hello Andy,

 

Thank you for your speedy response.

 

I've spoken to my garage regarding this and was advised that skimming the discs will only make them thinner - how much thinner is dependant on how much needs to be skimmed of each side. This will lead to the discs being more prone to heat and will just warp the discs again.

 

Regardless of the above, the discs have only been fitted for

 

I would much prefer to be sent a pair of replacement discs.

 

Thanks

 

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Please read our website about how to have your rotors machined on a pro cut centre. That is what is required. Replacing the parts will not solve this at all

 

If you would drive to Northpton we would do this for free. One in seven cars suffers what you have here

 

Thanks andy

 

Sent by I phone with best regards from Andy Freeman

 

CEO EBC Brakes

[Supercharged 2]

Shocking!

 

http://www.ebcbrakes.com/contact.shtml

[Critical_Mass 10]

wow you were quick! :D

 

What made me laugh is at the end he told me there were garages in yorkshire that could skim disc - i did ask why he didnt tell me this in the first place!!!! Ironically theres apparently a garage just 300 metres down the road from the garage i actually go to... but after speaking to my mechanic assures me the Peugeot garage does NOT skim discs. So the list i was sent is a little dubious.

 

Though as my mechanic also said is i didnt pay to get skimmed discs and i should request new ones. Which i have :-D

[dukest 0]

playing devil's advocate, doesnt a VW advisory document at least back up his argument slightly? am not disputing his odd way of going about things though..

[Critical_Mass 10]

playing devil's advocate, doesnt a VW advisory document at least back up his argument slightly? am not disputing his odd way of going about things though..

 

I was trusting what my mechanic said over him to be honest who was adament that regarding road cars it was nonsense though could apply to track/race cars. Plus It wouldnt be the first time ive been fobbed off with something and taken the bait to find out ive lost out.

[dukest 0]

yeah, nothing against that at all.. :salute:

[Critical_Mass 10]

:D if only i was as knowledgable on these things as other forum members

[Rob_B 0]

What a horrible bloke. Great way to talk to customers. I won't buy anything from ebc again after this. I think his email address needs spamming for being a dick.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Or do one of them spoof sites and post that email chain on it. What a knob. Clearly has no concept of customer service. EBC have got a crap reputation anyway, and he isn't helping to resolve it with an attitude like that!

[Goldie 2]

I had EBC discs on my old one and suprise suprise they warped. They did change them for me and i wanst out of pocket but i agree they arent the best..

 

I just changed discs and pads all round on my Golf and went for Genuine VW, with discount they are cheaper than EBC and quality wise they are spot on.

[Critical_Mass 10]

Well the new discs came today. I was half expecting a couple of bricks to be in the box instead of discs, or at the very least some sort of note in the box :lol:

 

I was going to do as Supercharged said and sell them and get some OEM discs, but to be honest i need the car and just want the brakes sorted.

 

Never again will i do business with EBC, ill try some other brand next time. :?

[KipVR 1]

I've had ebc brakes on my corrado before, and they warped, and juddered on braking at higher speeds.

 

Then I went on a track day and they somehow sorted themselves out! I've since had this problem on my wife's old Mk3, so I put some serious heat into them and sure enough they came out good too!

 

I think the trick is to make sure you cool them down slowly, or keep them cool in the first place. This is why I tried to fit G60 brake cooling ducts to my VR, but unfortunately they don't fit without a bit of modification which I haven't done yet.

 

Glad to see you got a new set though, I won't be shopping with them in the future.

[Critical_Mass 10]

I've had ebc brakes on my corrado before, and they warped, and juddered on braking at higher speeds.

 

Then I went on a track day and they somehow sorted themselves out! I've since had this problem on my wife's old Mk3, so I put some serious heat into them and sure enough they came out good too!

 

I think the trick is to make sure you cool them down slowly, or keep them cool in the first place. This is why I tried to fit G60 brake cooling ducts to my VR, but unfortunately they don't fit without a bit of modification which I haven't done yet.

 

Glad to see you got a new set though, I won't be shopping with them in the future.

 

Trouble is normal road use wont get enough heat in them. This is obviously a common problem, so i did kind of think i wouldnt have any problems getting another set of discs - i didnt expect to get abused for my trouble.

[Dan_Storm 0]

When i bought my Leon they had EBC discs all round. The fronts warped a couple of months after i had the car. I replaced the fronts which solved it. Now the rears are warped, thankfully it is not so noticable on the rear. Certainly won't be buying EBC in future!

[Jim 2]

Wow.. just... wow. Never seen an attitude like that before.

 

Worth mentioning now in 4 Corrado's and many many thousands of miles I've never had a set of VW discs warp!

[steveo29 0]

shocking

 

should post it up on piston heads , they like that kinda thing but no naming and shaming , abc discs should suffice

 

get it on a few popular forums and it will be top of the list on google

[OllieVR6 0]

Well I'll never buy anything from EBC after reading that. How do they have any customers left if that is how they talk to them??