No power steering!

[swiftkid 1]

So philuk has been having problems with no power steering. I popped over to have a look today and I'm about stumped as well. He had the rack reconditioned, it's had a new pump and changed pipes, still the same.

 

There's absolutely no noise/whining of any sort and no power steering at all, it's the same engine off and on. We tried to manually Bleed the rack today and we think we have fluid everywhere that needs to be and we've got all the air out we could.

 

We held the rack in lock and cracked the pipe to the chamber (the short hard line) but didn't seem like there was any pressure there.

 

The only thing I can think is that the pressure relief valve is stuck open or the pump isn't working fully so it's circulating but not pressurizing. Anyone have any clues or advice?

 

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[Dox 22]

Have you tried jacking the wheels off the floor to remove tyre resistance then turning lock to lock?

 

If still stiff, undo the trackrods from the knuckles, wheels back on move them a full sweep by hand with the rack disconnected to prove ball joints / top mounts aren't seized. At least then you've proved its not mechanical issues and you can concentrate on the PAS assembly.

[swiftkid 1]

Jacked it up and turns fine, it was my thought but you can turn the actual wheel by hand (not steering wheel) when you take the weight off.

 

The strange thing is, if it was something like top mount the pump would groan or something but engine note sounds exactly the same

 

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[Dox 22]

I'd try a known good used pump next.

 

You can use old magazines with shiny paper as skid plates under the tyres to lighten the load at the steering wheel whilst doing the lock to lock bleeding, but they don't last very long.

[swiftkid 1]

He's tried the original, one that came off my car that was 100% working and a brand new one. As far as I'm aware it does require some resistance when manually bleeding, its supposed to be a self bleeding system but we are trying not to assume anything about the system.

 

Do you know where the pressure relief valve is? I was told its behind the high pressure line in the rack but it was a royal git to get back in and I got covered in fluid so want to make sure before going at things with spanners again.

[Jim Bowen 1]

are the PAS pipes connected up to the correct holes on the rack?

[swiftkid 1]

I don't think you can get them the wrong way round, certainly don't seem that way but happy to be proven wrong

 

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[Dox 22]

Have you tried revving the engine to 4000RPM and seeing if there's more assistance then?

[swiftkid 1]

Yea, no difference, not even a slight wine. Just spoke to Phil and said he made sure high pressure pipe was clear before he put it on

 

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[Dox 22]

Who rebuilt the rack?

[swiftkid 1]

Not sure to be honest, thought Phil might be along to update but he's tried 2 different racks and same with both. All I'm thinking is it has to be pump

 

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[lilfuzzer 1]

Not sure to be honest, thought Phil might be along to update but he's tried 2 different racks and same with both. All I'm thinking is it has to be pump

 

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He has tried a couple of pumps that I know of Dave but I am in the same school as you

[1200 bandit 10]

Is the anywhere that you can fit a pressure gauge on the power steering system and see what pressure readings that you get

I have had this problem before (on a Renault)the NEW pump was giving the incorrect pressure to the system

[swiftkid 1]

He has tried a couple of pumps that I know of Dave but I am in the same school as you

Yea, one of them came off my vr6 when I changed engines so I know that works but after changing every part in the system we can't assume anything works.

 

The thing that makes me think it's the pump is that the engine note doesn't change, there is no straining or anything when moving the wheel so if it was top mount or something it would at least try. I'm thinking its damaged pressure relief valve, if that can happen

 

Not sure if Phil has access to pressure testing equipment. Would definitely be a good idea

 

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[lilfuzzer 1]

Yea, one of them came off my vr6 when I changed engines so I know that works but after changing every part in the system we can't assume anything works.

 

The thing that makes me think it's the pump is that the engine note doesn't change, there is no straining or anything when moving the wheel so if it was top mount or something it would at least try. I'm thinking its damaged pressure relief valve, if that can happen

 

Not sure if Phil has access to pressure testing equipment. Would definitely be a good idea

 

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Very true mate almost need several pumps there at once and see what happens. I did think that the top mounts maybe seated incorrectly but talking to Phil at Harewood he assured me they were correct

[Philuk 0]

I'm sad! And sulking, rack was sent to GB automotive in osset but they had it built for them, the rack I got originally was a rebuild and then the rack I got second time was my rack (the one that I sent back for the surcharge) rebuilt and sent back. They said they are tested before being shipped. It wasn't left stood so no chance of the seals going weird.

 

Gonna try find this pump I have of Dave's and try it again! We stripped one side coilovdr and the bearing is dead but this isn't just notchy. It's completely solid

[swiftkid 1]

We took them apart and the bearings were not great but regardless the steering would still have given it a go, there's absolutely nothing.

I cracked the pipe between the left/right pot and main rack pot whilst in lock and there was no pressure at all

 

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[Philuk 0]

As far as I know I've fitted and bled the pumps correctly.

 

Had the car off the ground, filled the reservoir until it's at max, span the pump by hand to make sure there was fluid in it and then started the car and kept an eye on the level. And then gradually worked it side to side. Dropped it back down and done it again!

[Dox 22]

Are all pulleys OE?

 

Do you have a hose collapsing internally (can you feed stiff fencing type wire through in both directions?

 

Is the column seized?

[Philuk 0]

Yea pulleys are standard, I have tried two different sets of hoses with the exact same problem on both (so I would say no and no hoses seem to be squashing anywhere) column seized, not sure how to check this? Was something else that I was going to look at but didn't know how to go about it

[Dox 22]

Yea pulleys are standard, I have tried two different sets of hoses with the exact same problem on both (so I would say no and no hoses seem to be squashing anywhere) column seized, not sure how to check this? Was something else that I was going to look at but didn't know how to go about it

 

The hoses don't look squashed, the delaminate inside and tear then act like a one way valve (this can happen on brake hoses).

 

Disconnect the column from the rack, it should turn freely - a seized column would explain why the pump never sounds under pressure on full lock?

[Philuk 0]

The hoses don't look squashed, the delaminate inside and tear then act like a one way valve (this can happen on brake hoses).

 

Disconnect the column from the rack, it should turn freely - a seized column would explain why the pump never sounds under pressure on full lock?

 

Undo the UJ and pull it away there?

[swiftkid 1]

Don't want to rule out column, definitely worth a try but it turns fine when wheels are off the ground

 

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[1200 bandit 10]

Just a thought is the correct pas fluid being used

[swiftkid 1]

He's tried 2 types.