16v engine service/refresh

[Kempy 0]

Morning. I'm gonna have a bit of time over the bank holiday to spend on the car hopefully. It does run and idle but it's not great, not been great for a while really. What jobs can I do to without major engine works to maybe help. Without spending too much if possible..I appreciate it's vague but just wanting things to do. Cheers in advance 

[Dox 23]

How old is the fuel? Fuel filter?

[Kempy 0]

It 100% needs a filter. The fuel has been in it a while. I just put a 6 litre can in it. How can you fully empty the tank? Just run it till it stops? 

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

12 minutes ago, Kempy said:

It 100% needs a filter. The fuel has been in it a while. I just put a 6 litre can in it. How can you fully empty the tank? Just run it till it stops? 

what year is it?

my 16v is a '90 & i was able to siphon the old fuel out using just a length of garden hose

did you empty the old fuel out before putting the 6 litres in?

a can of easy start helped to get my 16v back to life after it was sat for a while - these cars dont like to be sat still for extended periods 

[Kempy 0]

It's 92. No I've not taken any old fuel out just put new into the tank. I've got a pond/flood type pump I could use maybe to empty it. 

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

Just now, Kempy said:

It's 92. No I've not taken any old fuel out just put new into the tank. I've got a pond/flood type pump I could use maybe to empty it. 

hmmm how much old fuel was in there?

it would have been preferable to drain the old stuff first

92 is an early i think so shouldnt have an anti-siphon filler so should be easy to get the majority out

[Kempy 0]

I really wished there was someone local that could listen to it so I know where to start with it but I've found a decent bloke on YouTube doing a few videos for the 9a about timing it up and air/fuel mixtures so maybe I can sort it myself 

[Kempy 0]

Just now, g0ldf1ng3r said:

hmmm how much old fuel was in there?

it would have been preferable to drain the old stuff first

92 is an early i think so shouldnt have an anti-siphon filler so should be easy to get the majority out

I'll to that. It's had fuel sat in for a long time 

[Dox 23]

I assume the car's not road legat ATM?

 

Idling isn't good for an engine, much better on a long run at light throttle and under load - my VR6 hates starting and idling after having the battery reconnected

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

my 16v refused to run on the old fuel but after draining the tank, filling with fresh 99ron, fully charged battery & a can of easy start sprayed around she fired up after a few turns

it is worth whipping your spark plugs out to check for their condition

also have a spray of wd40 on & around the alternator belts etc

as long as your length of hose is long enough & the container you are emptying is lower than the fuel tank it is easy to siphon 

as for idle adjustment, AFIK there is a small idle screw you can play with but it is very sensitive so very small adjustments when you do

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

2 minutes ago, Dox said:

Idling isn't good for an engine

any idea why people say that dox?

ive never understood it tbh

[Kempy 0]

It's not MOt'd no, not been for a few years now. It does start mind, but only being able to drive on a small stretch of road behind the house. It's like it has poor throttle response. A new issue for it is that it was getting stuck in 1st gear(this feels like more of a selector issue to be) so there is probably a few things to worry about but I can start by having fresh fuel in it at least 

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

7 minutes ago, Kempy said:

It's not MOt'd no, not been for a few years now. It does start mind, but only being able to drive on a small stretch of road behind the house. It's like it has poor throttle response. A new issue for it is that it was getting stuck in 1st gear(this feels like more of a selector issue to be) so there is probably a few things to worry about but I can start by having fresh fuel in it at least 

poor throttle response could well be a gunked up throttle cable - how does the go pedal feel under foot?  is it very stiff in both directions?

once you have emptied the tank, filled with fresh & got it running again you can manually move the throttle from under the bonnet - this should give you a feel for where the lack of response is

the gear selector on top of the gear box can become very stiff & sticky when sat for that long - get it sprayed well with wd40, leave to soak & then start manipulating the gear selector itself

it took a good half hour at least of wriggling on my 16v to get the selector moving freely again

[Dox 23]

1 minute ago, g0ldf1ng3r said:

any idea why people say that dox?

ive never understood it tbh

Cold starts running on heavy mixtures (choke in old money) and long idling doesn't really create enough heat to keep plugs clean. You must have heard the scenario of the car owned by the old guy who never revved above 1500 RPM, only used the car to supermarket or church leading to rough running, then the new owner uses it normally and after a few week of normal use the car has a new lease of life? In a similar vain the ubiquitous Italian tune? Petrol on long runs cleans off contaminents off the back of the inlet valves too, build up here traps vapours and creates droplets instead.

 

DPFs in modern diesels need heat from a fast run to burn soot trapped inside the DPF to turn it to ash

[Kempy 0]

I'm at work atm but soon as I'm back I'll take a look at the pedals. The cable and selector could definately sticky and gunked up. I'll get this all looked at. Cheers all. I hope it's all pretty easy stuff. 

[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

6 minutes ago, Dox said:

Cold starts running on heavy mixtures (choke in old money) and long idling doesn't really create enough heat to keep plugs clean. You must have heard the scenario of the car owned by the old guy who never revved above 1500 RPM, only used the car to supermarket or church leading to rough running, then the new owner uses it normally and after a few week of normal use the car has a new lease of life? In a similar vain the ubiquitous Italian tune? Petrol on long runs cleans off contaminents off the back of the inlet valves too, build up here traps vapours and creates droplets instead.

 

DPFs in modern diesels need heat from a fast run to burn soot trapped inside the DPF to turn it to ash

yeah that all makes sense - i just wondered as i always let all me cars warm up on idle for a good few minutes before i drive off but then i also always go the long way on short journeys to give them a run

[fla 9]

Dox has highlighted a very important point, often overlooked by many unsuspecting owners.  Idling is really not good for a car, drive off as soon as possible, but of course give it time to allow the oil to warm up before using a heavy right foot.Long runs are always better for an engine as compared to short trips.  I would sooner get a car with 120k miles used as a motorway driver than one that's pootled around for 15 years but only done 10,000 miles

[fla 9]

Also, clean up the spark plugs  - check their condition before to get an idea of the firing of each cylinder.  Replace as necessary.  use some easy start on HT leads, check throttle body for any varnish or crud and clean up.  Maybe throw a bottle of redex fuel system cleaner into a tank.  

I did an engine 'flush' on a new purchase - drained old oil, filled with new, brought up to temp.  Drained again, replaced filter and refilled with fresh oil.  New air filter.

Check any air hoses for splits or breaks.  Check hose clamps to see if they are free and haven't cut hoses.

I would also spend a bit of time on relubing the brakes and checking everything moves freely. 

 

[Kempy 0]

This is the plug situation 

[Kempy 0]

Throttle cable seems ok but the clutch not so much. The selector is fine too.

The clutch pedal on the other hand doesn't come back up like it should so that's an issue. If that's a clutch out issue then I might as well take engine out kind of situation 

[Dox 23]

1 hour ago, Kempy said:

This is the plug situation 

They look rather old, even the ceramics are stained?

[Dox 23]

51 minutes ago, Kempy said:

Throttle cable seems ok but the clutch not so much. The selector is fine too.

The clutch pedal on the other hand doesn't come back up like it should so that's an issue. If that's a clutch out issue then I might as well take engine out kind of situation 

Mine did that before the clutch slave failed completely a month or so later. Easy job on an 02A, 2 m8 bolts and the hydraulic hose then bleed

[Kempy 0]

The plugs are fairly old in age but not miles. If that makes a difference? I will change them. I'll try the clutch slave. I got a nice list going. Cheers guys. I'm glad this place is still going. I'll see what places are open tomorrow. 😁

[_Matt_ 32]

My 16v (9a) project wasn't running as smooth when i saw it last week (it's stored away from home at the inlaws). My in tank fuel pump was dying (noisey) and evenutally failed completely - might be worth checking on yours. My symptons were a rough idle and a bit of black smoke on the exhaust. My fuel is also old - 3 years i'd say.  

I had not realised but you're meant to replace both fuel pumps when one fails as the other drags the good one down to failure. I had replaced the underbody one with a new bosch unit last year.

[Kempy 0]

I think my pumps are ok. Anyone know if it's easier to siphon the old fuel out through the boot with the lift pump taken out?