Newbie In Trouble...... Extreme Arch Rot, HELP!!

[JasonB-70 0]

Hi All,

 

Quick intro... I have owned my 1994 VR6 C for 5 years. Bought with a number of 'issues' like heater matrix, CV joints, wheel bearings all needing attention. Paid a fair price compared to the 'going rate' at the time so did all the work myself to get it back up to scratch. Rebuilt the engine top end, replaced rings, replaced the timing gear, clutch, big ends 3 years ago. Ignored the little bubbling rust on the drivers rear arch, hmmmmm hindsight whatta tool .

 

OK, on with the not so quick post...

 

Had my annual Moment Of Truth (MoT) last week, failed on a split steering gaitor, easy fix, and a few rust holes as they are within 12inches of seatbelt mounting points. Thought it could all be patched up so no big panic...yet.

 

I thought if I'm gonna do this and pay a sprayer to paint it, plus a few other little blemishes, I'm gonna do it right. So eliminate all the rusty metal back to good solid structure, make the patches, weld them in, flat back the welds, apply the fine surface filler and off to the sprayers easy eh?

 

Well up to the point I got the angle grinder out with the wire brush on it I was pretty confident. 20 minutes later I am sitting on a cold driveway with a corrado that has a 2 inch gap between the under/inner body and the rear quarter panel all the way from the rear bumper over what's left of the arch and along the sill to the door pillar. Scrap it, don't scrap it......panic :pale: .

 

See pic below

 

What I need is a rear arch repair kit, or a gallon of petrol and a lighter according to my brother!!! Most of the shape of the arch is still there so I don't want a quarter panel replacement which is a big job. The sill is very plateable but reforming a new arch will be near to impossible to get right. I have 2 well 3 choices as I see it.

1 - Source an arch repair kit and fit it, hopefully someone on here can help find one :-)

2 - Find a shell and cut off of it the arch 'bulge' all the way round plus 2 inches of under arch for welding to

or

3 - Scrap the car and next year drop the engine/box into my KONI modded MK2 Golf with KONI Fahrtronik suspension on it.

 

As I don't have a garage at the moment the engine swap is not really feasible so options 1 & 2 are the way to go. I have searched all over the net for an arch repair kit but I keep finding myself back at the main stealers looking at a new rear quarter at almost 600 squid which I'm then gonna cut off 2 inches around the arch and ditch the rest, I think not. There has to be somewhere out there with a pattern arch kit, doesn't there???? :scratch:

 

Can anyone help? Please? I did have one flash of brilliance, a front left wing, could it be cut down and used? New or 2nd hand it is much cheaper that a new 1/4 panel. I haven't measured radii etc yet so I don't know.

 

All suggestions / comments welcome except 'Just scrap it dude!!' ofcourse

 

Cheers,

 

JasonB

[VR6 0]

Moving to Exterior as this forum is for introductions. Technically you're a n00b but you'll probably get more help in the technical section of the forum :)

 

Welcome aboard!

[Toad 0]

Wow. That doesn't look happy.

 

Plenty of people breaking cas on here though, i'm sure that one of them would cut you out a panel and send it. I would offer, but mine is already promised to someone else...

 

Good example of rust building up in the bottom of the rear quarter panel on the inside in the bottom right of the pic.

 

Also looks like your filler neck is rotting out. Best sort that now too.

 

Good luck!

[mattnorgrove 0]

Gulp! Good luck with the repair mate, you might have a good idea using a front wing, the radii must be pretty close to one another. Keep us posted.

 

And welcome!

[MK1Campaign 0]

Thats going to need a new quarter if you want to cure the rust appearing arond the petrol flap too. You are also going to have to fabricate or buy a new inner arch too as that has gone . All depends how good the rest of the car to determine wether its worthwile.

[JasonB-70 0]

Wow, quick responses people, thanks.

 

Just been out in the cold to do a cardboard template of the n/s rear arch to compare to a front wing. Sadly it is not as close as I might have hoped :( It is still a possibility though but it'll take some bashing/stretching in the right places to pull it in tight enough to achieve the radius.

 

So before I go down that road hands up who has got a body with a 'good' rear arch that they would like to cut out for me in exchange for good ol' cash and the knowledge that they saved a dying Corrado? I'm based near Southampton and could travel to remove/collect it myself if you are not too far away. Come on people don't be shy :help: please?

 

JB

[Toad 0]

Lol. I might have a second spare arch seeing as you're so close. I'm just outside Winchester.

[g60greeny 0]

hope thats not from my rear quarters your storin for me

[Toad 0]

Nah, got a second car I can nick it from. Wouldn't give yours away. ;)

[Jay2 0]

Bugger!

 

Got the same bubbling around the rear arch as well AND around the fuel flap! :pale:

 

Had the whole side repaired and sprayed a few years ago but it looks like its back. :bad-words:

[JasonB-70 0]

Firstly thanks to VR6 (The mod) for not deleting my 1st post and making me stand in the corner for mis-behaving :nono:

I got a bit carried away, sorry.

 

Secondly, Toad, is this a real possibility? You have a second body with an arch that could be used? If so that would be brilliant. Let me know.

 

My car had definetly had a blow over on the rear quarter way before I got it. I don't know if it was to cover the start of the rust or somebody had scraped it. I know now that there was a very thin layer of filler on the edge but no lumps filling damaged areas so rust is most likely.

 

As for the filler surround, and any other rust spots/areas. I have a Clarke grit blaster that I am going to use to blast the rusty filler cap surround and then Kurust the heck out of it before giving it some rust resistant primer and several coats of protective paint before a final colour top coat. Hopefully that will keep any problems at bay for the next couple of years.

[M15 VW 0]

Toad- would Mr Beige's bare shell be of any use? He needs it gone.

[Toad 0]

Toad- would Mr Beige's bare shell be of any use? He needs it gone.

 

I don't think he needs enough of it really, unless he wants to resell the car? I forgot tht stu had the badcrumble still.

 

Wack me a PM about the arch, I'm sure we can arrange something.

[MK1Campaign 0]

The problem you will have with the fuel flap area is that the rust has come from the inside. Blasting wont do anything as the rust is right the way through the metal.

[JasonB-70 0]

The problem you will have with the fuel flap area is that the rust has come from the inside. Blasting wont do anything as the rust is right the way through the metal.

 

I must have been lucky for once because when I scraped and then blasted the area around the filler today it was pretty much all surface rust. It has a few little dimples but no swiss cheese here :D several coats of Kurust went on straight away to seal it all up, Hammerite tomorrow.

 

It's the amount of mud and other crud that is up behind there that annoys me. The back wheel basically picks up whatever it can and the throws it up into this nice little crap-trap that VW so kindly placed up there out of sight. Add a little bit of movement/vibration, the mud gets between the filler neck rubber and the panel and does a lovely grinding job on the painted edge which then lets the moisture get under the paint.

 

I'm tempted to give that little orrifice a ruddy good powerwash then dry it out, empty half a can of stonechip aerosol paint up there and follow it with a generous squirt of expanding foam. That'll keep the shite oot!!! Got to check the breather routes first and what that little white plastic thingy does that is attached to the filler neck behind the panel.

 

If you peel back your filler skin and stuff your finger in behind there it'll bring tears to your eyes :lol: .

[bigray 0]

OOOoooh nice, as for the arch, the proper way would be for a new 1/4 a new inner wheelarch to be fitted, however fitting a new 1/4 is a bit beyond driveway repairs. Even for me and im a panel beater. Thered be no point in "making" a section and welding in as it would distort to fcuk welding in and then youd have to put tons of filler in and itd still look a total mess. If you want it to look good, the only way is for the 1/4 and inner wheel arch to be done properly, Thats gunna cost a fair whack so is it gunna be cheaper to break it and sell the parts if theyre in decent nick?

 

The ruct around the fuel filler, even tho you think its gone, itl be back, trust me. Do soooooooo much rust work at work (prestige german car maker, dealer bodyshop) The only real way to cure rust is to replace the panel and ensure it is sealed, painted and waxed thouroughly, even then id still expect to see rust. Thats the pesamist in me. haha.

 

Good luck with whatever you do.

[JasonB-70 0]

Happy New Year All,

 

Haven't had time to post for a while as I have been trying to get this monster job tamed. Huge amount of rusty metal cut out on the inner arch :-( which has to all be replaced. You can't weld onto s**t rusty metal and expect it to survive very long can you??

I sourced a cut off rear quarter with some inner arch still attached but sadly it was cut a bumper level at the back so masses of heating bending bashing and MIG welding to rebuild the lower quarter area where the bumper bobbins fit. The end is in sight for that area now, just got to match it to the profiles I copied from the left side and flipped over. Plywood, a router, some filler and clingfilm are much better than the profile gauges I tried first. Once the lip has been recreated and all sealed up it will be fit to fly, well the back part anyway.

 

The arch will have to be TIG welded in to keep the distortion to a minimum, which will take me ages, better stock up on the gas bottles now!!! Then I have to try and recreate the back end of the sill, the curve, the lip and the endplate (part of inner arch originally). First attempts have been close but just not good enough :shrug: but once the arch and sill are solid it should make it easier to do, I hope.

 

I was going to attach some photos but I haven't got them off of my camera yet, DOH!!! Maybe tomorrow......

 

Money is too tight to think about another car at the moment and what with the 205GTi and the 16v Golf on my drive already strip mining is not really an option, divorce would be more highly likely I got got a 4th car too.

[bigray 0]

Why are you TIG welding it?

 

:salute:

[CorradoVR6-Turbo 0]

is less heat in tig than mig :scratch:

[bigray 0]

TIG is usually used on aluminium as this has a much lower melting point then steel. Plus its an absolute :censored: to do. Never heard of steel being TIG'd, always MIG or gas.

 

:salute:

[CorradoVR6-Turbo 0]

Ive only seen tig being used on stainless,but i suspect with the right gas and rods you can do anything?

[JasonB-70 0]

The reason for the TIG is to be able to run a much lower amperage and therefore reduce the amount of heat that is going into the job, less heat = less distortion. It's a bit like gas welding but with a tiny electric flame. You get a tiny pool of molten metal at the end of your torch, just like gas, and then run along the seam adding the filler rod as necessary. If I had a gas setup then I probably would use that but sadly I'm all electric.

 

My background in the aero industry where TIG is extensively used especially on jet engine components where heat distortion could cost you hundreds of thousands in scrapped parts.

 

You can weld just about anything with TIG from aluminium alloys to ferrous metals even copper sheet. With TIG you don't get that pidgeon s**t effect like you do when the MIG 'stutters' (for want of a better word). I choose when to add the filler rod instead of the MIG feeding it out the nozzle at a rate of knots whether it is arcing and melting or not.

 

I will tack the arch in a dozen places to get everything where it needs to be and then, once I check my profile guages for correct positioning, fill in the gaps.The rest of the job has been MIG welded and ground back to make it look neater. If the TIG proves to be a pain after tacking the arch in place then i will drag the MIG out and do it that way. Then slap on the filler but if going slower means less distortion then that's the way it has to be.

[bigray 0]

Fairdoos, im a panel beater so do stuff like that all day long, never heard of TIG used on steel, Im guessing as its such a pain in the arse to master and its quicker to use MIG.

 

Good luck with it

 

 

:salute:

[colinstubbs 0]

Good work mate, any photos you can bang up for the curious?

[JasonB-70 0]

WARNING - THE FOLLOWING PHOTOS ARE NOT TO BE VIEWED BY CORRADO OWNERS OF A NERVOUS DISPOSITION :pale:

 

 

Book1.pdf1. Just A Small Hole - Easy Peasey.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

What started out as small hole at the bottom of the rear arch was the doorway to a much bigger world of problems once the bumper was removed...

stromlaufplan_gamma4.pdf2. Then After The Bumper Came Off.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

ETKA Corrado.pdf3. Does Not Look So Easy Now.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

 

ARGHHHHHHH!!!!! Oh well, s**t happens. We have the tools, we can rebuild you. You won't be pretty but you'll be tougher. Then when the bumper is back on you'll be hidden too, woohoo, bonus!!

stromlaufplan_gamma4.pdf4. The Rebuild Begins.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

Corrado92.pdf5. Panel Seal It, Paint It, Refit Bumper Jobs A Goodun.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

 

Thanks to Josh (mariojoshi) for the quarter panel, shame it didn't have the rear structure still on it but it had the necessary inner arch material that is essential to this reconstruction.

passat climatronic wiring diags.pdf6. The Donor Arch Trimmed To Fit.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

climatronic wiring-Golf from May 01.pdf7.First Trial Fit, We Progress, Inner Arch Good Too.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

 

Before the arch is fitted the sill work is being done whilst the gap is there at the arch to give better access and so the whole area can be flooded with sealer/waxoyl once all welding is complete along there.

The seam where the floor and sill meet was a bit ropey so a piece of new angle was welded in to give the sill plate something strong to be welded to.

2.8l 24v Climatronic system.pdf8. New Sill Metal Needed Something Better To Secure To, New Angle Welded In Place.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

 

The MoT tester :hitler: won't be tapping his little hammer through this bugger at the retest

9. Front Part Of New Sill Welded And Ground Back Ready To Be Sealed And Stone Chipped.jpg[/attachment:2uczlhxv]

 

Well that's about it so far. Weather stopped play today :( but hopefully a few good nights this week and it'll be pretty much done.

 

Thanks to all of those that have left comments, I know your thoughts are with me :notworthy: Thanks