Dead again :(

[scott1980 10]

My 2.0 16v 9a has decided to start messing me about...the swine !

 

It's cut out on me a couple of times (once on a roundabout) and is starting to get on my tits a bit (still love it though !)

 

The first time it cut out was after about a minute of driving , on a roundabout , with the clutch in , and it just died to nothing without a lurch or a splutter...the revs went and all my lights on my dash came on (as if i'd just turned the ignition on).

I tried about 3 times to start it but it wouldn't have it , luckily someone gave me a push and i bumped it and off i went . I just crossed my fingers and put it down to being "weird" . This was last week ..

 

So today , under slightly different conditions 30 mph 4th gear...same happened...no revs , all the lights , so I coasted into a bus stop and waited about 2 minutes..started fine and pulled away. Partly in anger , i planted my foot in first gear and at about 4500 revs it lurched like fook , revs dropped to almost nothing so i quickly dipped the clutch and apologised to her and drove carefully to Currys ( my telly has broke ..another sob story )

 

Going back home I give it some , to see if it did it again ( I know ...) and going uphill in third (not accelerating hard) there was a mahoosive backfire , the revs dropped but before I could do anything it picked back up and off home i went !

 

I should add that 1) It has become slightly lumpy when not accelerating , lurching a little at low revs .

2) In summer my immobiliser ( Serpi Star ) connector had a dodgy connection and was cutting the engine and ignition . I don't think its this

because the ignition light remain on when it dies.

I'm far from being an expert , and like most Corrado owners ( I think ) would like to be able to do anything that needs doing myself , more so for satisfaction than cost cutting.

 

Could it be a fuelling problem , dodgy pump ,filter , clogged injectors ?

 

I intend to treat it to some Redex to try and solve the lumpy drive , and start there..but if there's something more sinister going on then i'd prefer it not to go bang completely !!:scratch:

 

---------- Post added at 8:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 7:59 PM ----------

 

AND ...occasionally when starting up it splutters a bit , think thats about it

[seanl82 23]

Crank sensor possibly???

[Ruggy 10]

I've recently replaced my crank sensor to cure a similar problem, the main difference was that it only ever cut out when the engine was hot, I was told this was the biggest giveaway that the crank sensor was the problem.

[davidwort 0]

Crank sensor? No such thing on a 9a 16v, more likely to be a hall sender on the dizzy as it sounds more like an ignition problem than fuelling. Worth checking fuel pump relay though, does the pump buzz when the car dies and you try but it fails to restart?

[scott1980 10]

Crank sensor? No such thing on a 9a 16v, more likely to be a hall sender on the dizzy as it sounds more like an ignition problem than fuelling. Worth checking fuel pump relay though, does the pump buzz when the car dies and you try but it fails to restart?

 

Hall sender ... does that have something to do with stretching a spring in the cap ?

And come to think of it , I haven't heard the usual sort of *buzz* when i turn the ignition on , just before starting (when it dies then tries) .

 

If it was the hall sender would it cut out completely or splutter and die ? Mine just GOES and I get that "oh ****" feeling ! The lurching is also a bit of squeaky bum time !

 

I mainly do short journeys too , so I would say that the problem has occured from 1 minute to 10 minutes of driving , and was fairly hot when the massive ( and it was bloody massive ) backfire / lurch happened .... makes me think the massive backfire was fuel being sent but not ignited due to a problem in the cap like u said ? combination of both maybe ?

Edited November 7, 2012 by scott1980

[rado mc 0]

Had mine do something similar over a week or so, no real pattern to it nothing, no matter how much I tried to save it and stop it cutting either at 60 or 6mph it was quite dangerous the power would just disappear in an instant. then the next day be fine until it decided to do it again.

Distributer had a bad central connection inside or was on deaths door can't remember full explination but £60 for a new one and all sorted.

Hope this helps.

[davidwort 0]

Hall sender is the distributor rotor arm position sensor built into the distributor side, the 3 wire connection can get broken wires but the sensor itself can fail, to test you need an led test light connected to the end pins of the ignition control unit, and spin the engine over, a pic of this is in another post recently from me on a similar subject. With no hall sender signal the ignition will cut completely from the coil, so no spark for any plug.

[scott1980 10]

Had mine do something similar over a week or so, no real pattern to it nothing, no matter how much I tried to save it and stop it cutting either at 60 or 6mph it was quite dangerous the power would just disappear in an instant. then the next day be fine until it decided to do it again.

Distributer had a bad central connection inside or was on deaths door can't remember full explination but £60 for a new one and all sorted.

Hope this helps.

 

I know the feeling , scary when it goes..I'm driving it with my foot hovering over the clutch just in case it dies :eek: It was quite "lumpy" this morning and at one point the rev needle shot way up then down again , quickly , twice , with no real change in engine revs ( again just lurched a bit ).

 

Hall sender is the distributor rotor arm position sensor built into the distributor side, the 3 wire connection can get broken wires but the sensor itself can fail, to test you need an led test light connected to the end pins of the ignition control unit, and spin the engine over, a pic of this is in another post recently from me on a similar subject. With no hall sender signal the ignition will cut completely from the coil, so no spark for any plug.

 

Aaaah , that would explain the sudden loss , and , it's in the distributor . Might just start there and replace the bugger , was going to change plugs - leads - cap ( looked at the points yesterday and they were fairly pitted )

 

It's a temperamental bitch at the minute and hard to trust when driving , cleaned points and rotor arm yesterday , drove home , went back out later on and it started and died instantly .. a wiggle of the leads and away I went ( coincidence possibly ..theres no tracking )

 

 

It SOUNDS fairly simple and relatively inexpensive to cure , thanks for your help chaps i'll get it sorted soon enough :thumbleft:

Edited November 9, 2012 by scott1980

[scott1980 10]

well ... this may be unrelated , so i'll probably repost anyway .... but yesterday , after weeks of not "doing it" ... it died completely , a flutter of revs , dipping very low , so i revved it a little , then the revs fell off and it died. But now it wont start , and theres no dash LED's on when i turn the ignition . I had a similar problem with identical symptoms a while back and i found it was a dodgy connector on the immobiliser . Im fairly sure its not the connector , but maybe the immobiliser is goosed completely....I get all power , it turns over , lights , blower etc ... no leccy windows or dash LED's and it wont start

[scott1980 10]

Its head scratching time again .... well ... yesterday after a spell of "being good" ( had an odd problem recently posted "intermittent death" on here )it died completely , a flutter of revs which dipped very low when idle , so i revved it a little , then the revs fell off and it died. But now it wont start , and theres no dash LED's on when i turn the ignition . I had a similar problem with identical symptoms a while back and i found it was a dodgy connector on the immobiliser . Im fairly sure its not the connector , but maybe the immobiliser is goosed completely....I get all power , it turns over , head lights , blower etc ... no leccy windows, fuel pump prime or dash LED's and it wont start .

 

What can I check before assuming it's the immobiliser and paying an autoleccy to rip the ******* out (or bypass it)

 

I've reseated , tapped , opened and checked all the relays ...SEEM fine , checked all fuses too

 

oh ye , its a 16v 9a ....hopefully someone can point me in the right direction

[Nathan Harvey 10]

Ignition barrel and ignition switch maybe I was getting no dash leds when turn the key and engine wouldn't start , just a thought

[scott1980 10]

Possibly yeah , never had any trouble starting before , apart from the immobiliser ... come to mention it , when i press the ignition barrel hole ( metal bit where the key goes ) even without a key in it , my radio powers up ! HA ...done that for a while too !

Did yours turn over when you turned the key ?

 

 

Its doin my nut in because it's EXACTLY the same thing happening as when the connector was goosed

[Nathan Harvey 10]

It was intermittent , at first everything light up on key position 2 then when I cranked it nothing , thought it was my immobiliser , get car electrician to rip it out still the same . I change both the barrel and the switch in the end and it started . I could start it with out the switch connected to the barrel if you get me , taking the switch off the key barrel and using a screw driver to turn the switch . It's not hard to strip the column down to get the switch off to change or just to try and maybe eliminate that part of the system . If you search my posts I think I posted pics of the barrel and switch on the stripped down column .

[Supercharged 2]

Sounds like the switch to me!

[scott1980 10]

It was intermittent , at first everything light up on key position 2 then when I cranked it nothing , thought it was my immobiliser , get car electrician to rip it out still the same . I change both the barrel and the switch in the end and it started . I could start it with out the switch connected to the barrel if you get me , taking the switch off the key barrel and using a screw driver to turn the switch . It's not hard to strip the column down to get the switch off to change or just to try and maybe eliminate that part of the system . If you search my posts I think I posted pics of the barrel and switch on the stripped down column .

 

Cheers guys , any info is much appreciated ...It's doing my tits in !! Fine for months then *ping* ..gone !! why do i have all other power , and why did it suddenly just go ?!

 

Is there a quick way to test the switch other than strip all the column down ,maybe rub 2 wires together like they do in films haha ... I'm not bad with tinkering wi stuff but i'm no Aircraft Engineer :silly: Is it essential to take the steering wheel an stuff off ?

 

 

I can't get away from thinking it's the immobiliser , EXACTLY the same symptoms as last time , the connector pin at fault was the earth connection for the immobiliser controller ... same thing , just died and wouldn't come back , but i'm 99.9 % sure its not the connector ( been ok for 2 months )

 

Ill try the switch ( somehow ) tomorrow , in the 30 mins of dusk light after work ......couldn't break down in summer :bad-words:

Edited December 3, 2012 by scott1980
OCD

[Portent 0]

Have you checked that both battery terminals are connected firmly?

[scott1980 10]

Have you checked that both battery terminals are connected firmly?

 

Yeah pal , both quite firm , I can turn the positive terminal with a bit of a shove though ...and come to think of it , its a tad greasy somehow .

The pile of receipts I got with the car shows about 4 battery purchases in about 6 years (maybe less) Im getting 12v from the battery tho , but on full lock my PAS belt squealed a bit , this is the same belt for the alternator ? .....my head is hurting now haha :bonk:

[OllieVR6 0]

Try this:

 

http://the-corrado.net/showthread.php?3167-Emergency-Ignition-Switch-Bypass

[scott1980 10]

Excellent , should be able to knock one of those up at work if I get a min (and we've got some suitable wire in)

Even if I eliminate certain things it's all progress , and could save time and money should I have to take it to a professional (I'd much much rather do anything myself tho)

[Graphite 0]

If the ignition switch bypass does not work try replacing the ECU relay on the relay panel with the fusebox. I had a very similar issue with my G60 where it would just randomly die and randomly just start working again. I got lights on dash, fuel pump prime etc but just wouldn't start. The relay for the G60, not sure if it's the same for a 16v was about £12.50 from dealer...

 

I had my immobilizer ripped out... then replaced the coil, dizzy and rotor, leads. Spent over 400 quid diagnosing a faulty £13 quid relay... fail...

 

Troy.

[tentonhammer 10]

Had this EXACT problem on my 9A, eventually the car just shut down and I was left stranded for 3 hours at 2:00am miles from home! The AA gave me a lift home eventually.

 

This is almost definitely Hall sender failure without a doubt. I fitted a brand new distributor (hall sender included) which cured the problem immediately.

 

If it's lurching and mis-firing when hot then it's worth checking your coolant temp sensor as well (located on the right side of the engine block, below and slightly to the left coolant flange ). Easiest way to do this is to unplug the connector and take the car for a spin. I had this problem as well as hall sender failure

[scott1980 10]

In the past couple of days ive tried booster leads onto my battery ... checked good earth to body and I made a lead to bypass the ignition switch as per the photo , which had no effect , was expecting the starter to turn (as it does with the key) when i touched the two remaining spade connectors..but nothing , still no LED's either. So today , torch in mouth , I tested the resistance of the coil as per the haynes manual for 9A engines (passat) ... connections 1-15 (primary winding) showed 0 ohms , should be 0.6-0.8 ohms and connections 4-15 showed 6.5 ohms which was correct...possibly a buggered ignition coil ?? would this prevent my dash LED's from lighting and car starting ?

 

Always thought the Dash LED's looked a bit naff but I've never missed them so much :(

[Supercharged 2]

Coil shouldn't affect the clocks getting power - something more fundamental going on here like a failed relay on an aftermarket imobiliser...

 

Have you got AA cover? could get them out if so as usually very get at electrical diags...

[scott1980 10]

My first thought was the immobiliser , exactly the same syptoms when the connector was being tricky , quite possibly the immobiliser itself ...got all diagrams for immobiliser , and Corrado manual (bentley) and haynes passat manual ... its been fairly "wet" with condensation in the car recently , maybe a bit of a sticky relay like you say ...everything else works , motor turns over , blowers etc , but no elec windows . Its a total closure doofer , so presumably its cutting power to those too ?

 

Tempted to take the immobiliser itself out and take a look ..have to wait till weekend tho , cant be doing with dribbling with the torch in my mouth anymore !!!! haha

 

Its getting time to seek professional help like u say , im not covered by AA but have spoken to a local auto leccy place , who said leave it with them for a "couple of days " !!! At least I can tell whoever does work on it what I have already eliminated .

[Supercharged 2]

Hmm - yeah the fact the windows don't work is a good clue - fuse for these is seperate to the main ones above the fusebox - worth checking in case the feed to the imob comes from this...

 

If you find a relay it will most likely be a standard auto one like the headlight looks use.