The Forced Induction 16V Thread

[LowG 0]

With the bettle valvecover breather I have had no problems with blowby, just the 1 breather on the head is more than enough for our motors.

 

About going 1.8T, its been said before, if you want just a little more power ie what a chiped 1.8t will provide at best (270) then might be ok to go for a 1.8T conversion. If you are looking for more power than its a different issue and staying 16v and adding a turbo makes sense.

[Bushy 0]

LowG it think i meet you at No Rice last week, i was the one who bent your ear for about 20mins whilst edmiring your engine bay! :roll: Once ive sourced a 2.0ltr kr block i'll definatly be bothering you some more!!

 

We spoke about exhaust mainifolds and you mentioned about some that are prone to cracking. This is what i have:

 

 

which i believe to be from here:

 

http://www.woodyracing.de/index.php?id=9

 

but if you have any info/advice let me know! Also inlet manifolds+fuel rails how much can you produce them for??

[LowG 0]

LowG it think i meet you at No Rice last week, i was the one who bent your ear for about 20mins whilst edmiring your engine bay! :roll: Once ive sourced a 2.0ltr kr block i'll definatly be bothering you some more!!

 

We spoke about exhaust mainifolds and you mentioned about some that are prone to cracking. This is what i have:

 

 

which i believe to be from here:

 

http://www.woodyracing.de/index.php?id=9

 

but if you have any info/advice let me know! Also inlet manifolds+fuel rails how much can you produce them for??

 

hi mate how you doing.

 

Yea looks like you have one of those thin walled manifolds, tubular bended with a half 4-1 collector job. Because they are so thin walled 1.5mm at best they are prone to cracking under stress. When you add a 5+kg turbo and downpipe and some of the exhaust weight then it all puts alot of stress on the mani.

 

Also im not sure if these manifold are stress relieved when they are welded. To have some more insurace for it not to crack I would brace the turbo onto the engine. You make up a bracket conecting turbo or the T3 flange onto the engine. If you wrap it you might increase chances of cracking too.

Give it a go and keep an eye on it.

 

Its also a good idea to support the wastegate aswell if you are going for a screamer pipe.

 

 

KR are 1.8 liter, I have one here if you are looking for one. Best to find a 9a as they are 2l, bore it over to a 2.1. If you need more info on this let me know, I have the right pistons/conrod package for this.

 

I do make intake manifolds, i sent you a pm ;).

[Bushy 0]

Cheers for the pm ;)

 

Like you say its the 9a/6a 2ltr that im really after, pretty much to go down the same route as yours! As soon as my bikes sold i can start spending some more! :wink:

[VEEDUBBED 0]

Need an oil line for the turbo?,don't fancy building a custom job?,do like i did and use a spare fuel line off a KR engined valver's fuel dist. unit,you'll need the longest line that starts from the metering head and goes to the fuel regulator that's bolted near the cyl. head.

I've had mine on for over a month now with no problems,only thing you'll have to do is drill out the smaller banjo fitting if using Garret blowers.KKK,holset,IHI could be different,check first.

The banjo bolts used to secure the fuel metering pipes have the same thread as Garret turbos so you can use those.

[tut_gareth 0]

just a thought... ( i know i shoudn't)

 

would the pistons and rods from a 1.8 20V turbo (eg an AGU) lump, fit into a KR block to lower the compression?

(as i'm going to keep my coversion a 1.8 for the moment)

 

i've got a KKK audi RS2 modified for 16V setup, any helpful info would be great.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

KR and 1.8T rods are the same, so I'm sure the AGU pistons will work in the KR.

 

KR rods are made of cheese though. I'd uprate them personally. Seen far too many 1.8T's bend rods when people slap ATP eliminator GT28RS kits onto their lumps and expect the stock manifold to expel the gases fast enough.

[Bushy 0]

Right managed to pick up engine for my 16vt build! :)

 

Its an audi 6A engine though so as far as i know theres a few things im going to need to change when looking to put it in a raddo! Any idea what the differences are people?

[mrbeige 0]

Right managed to pick up engine for my 16vt build! :)

 

Its an audi 6A engine though so as far as i know theres a few things im going to need to change when looking to put it in a raddo! Any idea what the differences are people?

 

AFAIK the oil pick-up and sump are two things that you will need to change. I'm pretty sure davidwort has a 6A bottom end in his Corrado.

[GazzaG60 0]

the kr rods will do around 300hp no issues. think they are the same as 9a rods which with ARP rod bolts will hold 350 wheel.

 

seems that 9a pistons and rods will hold more than 1.8t stuff.

 

its the torque spike of the 28rs that breaks things. high boost small turbo = high torque@low rpm=broken bits.

 

 

as a rule of thumb id say upto 300hp stack gaskets on a standard motor and run a bar with a good tune.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

1.8T and all 16V rods are the same part number on ETKA, VW pushing the boat out again :-)

 

I watched an Audi S3 bend rod number 4 on Stealth's rollers last Monday. Reason being the customer fitted an ATP Eliminator kit, which uses the standard 1.8T manifold. If you look at a 225 1.8T manifold closely, you'll soon realise you can barely get your finger up a runner!! Now with all that extra boost stuggling to get out of that manifold, something has to give, and in this case rod no 4 S bended, smashed the oil injector, wrecked the crank trigger wheel and scrapped the block.

 

You are bang on.... it maxed at 300hp and she could take no more captain....

 

ATP quote 350hp for the eliminator, but not with that standard manifold it won't......so the customer bought a proper kit off a guy in the UK who races TTs, forget the name of the company but it's proper stuff with a proper bore manifold.

 

This is why as LowG says, 1.8Ts are good to a point, then they get expensive and fragile. I don't personally like 1.8Ts. The delivery is a bit too spikey and surgey for my liking, but there are good ones out there that have had the money put into them.

 

16V T a much better engine, imo..... stealth have got a beaut of a 16VT on their stand at the moment.....it's lush.

 

Sorry, a bit O/T there.....

[mrbeige 0]

16V T a much better engine, imo..... stealth have got a beaut of a 16VT on their stand at the moment.....it's lush.

 

Yeah I saw that....and the exhaust manifold, bit of a piece of art!

 

Looking forward to seeing off a few VR's (not yours Kev :lol: ) to be honest, including the missus when she gets one!!

[Kevin Bacon 5]

'Seeing off' a few VRs! Mate, with a 16V T you will more than see them off :lol:

 

The only thing the VR will be able to do is reign you back in at the top end due to your shorter gearing ;-)

[GazzaG60 0]

*cough* tdi box *cough*

 

should see some nice battles in the coming year or so with so many turbo conversions on the way. along with a big queue at the tyre shop

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Been thinking about cog swapping myself..... but I like the midrange shorter ratios give 8)

[GazzaG60 0]

thats why i got a 02m petrol box and also cos its stronger.

 

when i spoke to stealth they said they had never seen a broken cog.

 

in genral longer gears tends to suit more turbo owner to maximise the benifits of the turbo but after my mate did the 6 speed swap in his impreza with the t04r it was great. using the bigger turbo also means more power at the top so the shorter ratios are not that limiting

 

think its time for a 02M for you kev too if you like the short stuff

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Yeah I was going to mention the O2M. Brilliant fitment guide for a VR here..... http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2633108

 

Allegedley it can put down 400whp with the stock internals and clutch!!

 

I think you're right, defo time for the O2M. Need to let my wallet rest and recover for a while first.

[Yandards 0]

Nice thread on the 02M fitment. Should work for G60's and valvers too as the gearbox is identical.

 

Only issue would be those already raised by the vortex thread, i.e. the driveshafts and the front and rear mounts.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Yeah, I liked that thread as he showed the work arounds aswell as the problems, and the image quality of his camera is top notch too!

 

Those driveshafts he used are awesome.....and the dollar is still weak ;-)

http://www.driveshaftshop.com/

[GazzaG60 0]

a quick few bits here then

 

rear mount - dutch dub

front mount home made.

 

G60 use inner cvs from a transporter 108mm top standard spline shafts.

VR use cut down standard 02m ones to vr outers

you need

starter

slave

selector

clutch

flywheel

 

 

drivelink will make shafts too for similar money

 

i have all but the custom shafts which im gonna have made off the cut down G60 ones so they are the right length first time.

[Yandards 0]

Some more options for us FI valver boys (and girls) its not just the VR monkeys that get nice shinny bits!

 

On a inlet manifold front for these conversions I have just received my new inlet manifold from RPM Tuning in Germany Link here It is based on a cut down S2 manifold but is a custom casting without the internal 'tubes' the S2 has.

 

Another option is BBM have just started producing the 'bomb' Again a very nice inlet manifold and the weak dollar means that this will cost around the same as the RPM option. Link here The 16v billet coolant flange they sell is a very nice piece of kit and will last a lot longer than the plastic crap VW sell.

[GazzaG60 0]

looks like that manifold can only take a standard throttle body.not really big enough for large power. a bit to small in the plenum too id say.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Not really liking the bomb. The RPM appears to be better designed, being tapered to prevent unequal boosting and looks OE.

 

Need to be careful with some of these logs with the boost pressures you 16V T boys run! Cheapy ones can literally be seen to balloon when being dynoed, so cast manifolds better in that respect.

[mrbeige 0]

Not really liking the bomb. The RPM appears to be better designed, being tapered to prevent unequal boosting and looks OE.

 

That's one of the reasons I'm using a 20v inlet. Just need the bugger modified now!!

[GazzaG60 0]

manifold still want to be bigger.

 

boost in the head not in the inlet