F1 Season Explained 2009

[Critical_Mass 10]

Don't get me wrong, I agree they do seem to get preferential treatment sometimes which I think spoils it despite being an avid fan. I'd rather they won because they have the best cars and the best drivers. Then it's actually an achievement. Also I want the other teams to do well so it's actually a competition. Bring it on I say. I bet Vettel kicks ass this season. He's someone I'm really looking forward to following this year.

 

yup, Vettel will be one to watch this season. Maybe even Kubica.

[Skimask 0]

The new points rules is the way to go.....the previous points system encouraged mediocrity.

I think it will spice the season up - but we'll have to wait and see how it goes this season.

[Philmo 0]

I don't actually hate Ferrari, I just dislike the way they seem to get preferential treatment in the paddock whenever the stewards are involved. I like Raikonnen when he can be arsed to turn up, but Massa only got there cos his manager is Jean Todt's son. And we all know what position old Jean held at the time. :wink:

 

I don't care who wins as long as its not Alonso the monobrow moaner or Massa the hamster.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Couldn't agree more Jim.

Brawn/Barrichello/Button have put in some interesting initial performances & I hope they get the funding they deserve.

I very much support Bernie's initiative - there's no room in sport for "strategic losers"!!

[corozin 0]

I have to say I think this rule change is just a stupid idea.

 

Back in the early 90's Nigel Mansell won the first 5 Grand Prix of the season in a row. By the 10th GP at Hockenheim he'd won 8 races. Under these rules Mansell would have won the championship with 6 races to go and could have had the rest of the season off, or just pottered around at the back waving his trophy at the fans.

 

Consider that in situations where the championship leader is being harrassed by a slower contender there will under these rules now be a huge incentive to "do a Schumacher" and punt the overtaking car off, even if that causes both to retire. Where the win is all that counts a lose-lose will be a preferred option to a win-lose and that is just outright dangerous for the drivers. Anyone who says drivers won't shove other drivers off-circuit in these cirumstances should look back to incidents involving ex-F1 champions such as Schumacher, Senna and Prost.

 

This is a stupid, stupid idea. I'm sure the calculation behind it is to ensure that MacLaren don't get into another one of thier historic periods of domination, but if (as pre season testing suggests may be the case) Jenson Button wins a lot of races straight out of the box with the new rules then I wouldn't be surprised to see Bernie trying to backtrack on this. You can certainly expect Ferrari to protest (and in court) if they come to the view that thier driver's chances are adversely affected by this change.

[Critical_Mass 10]

I have to say I think this rule change is just a stupid idea.

 

Back in the early 90's Nigel Mansell won the first 5 Grand Prix of the season in a row. By the 10th GP at Hockenheim he'd won 8 races. Under these rules Mansell would have won the championship with 6 races to go and could have had the rest of the season off, or just pottered around at the back waving his trophy at the fans.

 

Consider that in situations where the championship leader is being harrassed by a slower contender there will under these rules now be a huge incentive to "do a Schumacher" and punt the overtaking car off, even if that causes both to retire. Where the win is all that counts a lose-lose will be a preferred option to a win-lose and that is just outright dangerous for the drivers. Anyone who says drivers won't shove other drivers off-circuit in these cirumstances should look back to incidents involving ex-F1 champions such as Schumacher, Senna and Prost.

 

This is a stupid, stupid idea. I'm sure the calculation behind it is to ensure that MacLaren don't get into another one of thier historic periods of domination, but if (as pre season testing suggests may be the case) Jenson Button wins a lot of races straight out of the box with the new rules then I wouldn't be surprised to see Bernie trying to backtrack on this. You can certainly expect Ferrari to protest (and in court) if they come to the view that thier driver's chances are adversely affected by this change.

 

Exactly, the season could be over by the 8th race, how boring would that be knowing who's going to take the championship so early on. At least with the point system even if a driver wins the first 8 races, where as another driver could have come 2nd in the first 8 races, this would still leave a chance (no matter how unlikely) that the driver with 8 wins could fail to finish in the points for the lat 6 races, and the driver with the first 8 2nd places could still take the championship (that make sense? :lol:).

 

But to best honest, im not convinced at Brawns team finishing near the top in a race purely down to performance - testing times are not reliable enough to make that sort of judgment. Dont get me wrong, they could do really well in the first race and through out the season. But to go from a failed car to a front runner in the space of one winter even with the rule changes, im sceptical. Good luck to them, but i'll have to wait and see before i say they will be front runners.

[vwdeviant 0]

I have to say I think this rule change is just a stupid idea.

 

Back in the early 90's Nigel Mansell won the first 5 Grand Prix of the season in a row. By the 10th GP at Hockenheim he'd won 8 races. Under these rules Mansell would have won the championship with 6 races to go and could have had the rest of the season off, or just pottered around at the back waving his trophy at the fans.

 

Consider that in situations where the championship leader is being harrassed by a slower contender there will under these rules now be a huge incentive to "do a Schumacher" and punt the overtaking car off, even if that causes both to retire. Where the win is all that counts a lose-lose will be a preferred option to a win-lose and that is just outright dangerous for the drivers. Anyone who says drivers won't shove other drivers off-circuit in these cirumstances should look back to incidents involving ex-F1 champions such as Schumacher, Senna and Prost.

 

This is a stupid, stupid idea. I'm sure the calculation behind it is to ensure that MacLaren don't get into another one of thier historic periods of domination, but if (as pre season testing suggests may be the case) Jenson Button wins a lot of races straight out of the box with the new rules then I wouldn't be surprised to see Bernie trying to backtrack on this. You can certainly expect Ferrari to protest (and in court) if they come to the view that thier driver's chances are adversely affected by this change.

 

Exactly, the season could be over by the 8th race, how boring would that be knowing who's going to take the championship so early on. At least with the point system even if a driver wins the first 8 races, where as another driver could have come 2nd in the first 8 races, this would still leave a chance (no matter how unlikely) that the driver with 8 wins could fail to finish in the points for the lat 6 races, and the driver with the first 8 2nd places could still take the championship (that make sense? :lol:).

 

But to best honest, im not convinced at Brawns team finishing near the top in a race purely down to performance - testing times are not reliable enough to make that sort of judgment. Dont get me wrong, they could do really well in the first race and through out the season. But to go from a failed car to a front runner in the space of one winter even with the rule changes, im sceptical. Good luck to them, but i'll have to wait and see before i say they will be front runners.

 

 

My tuppence is it will turn F1 into "Bin-it or Win-it" and lets throw the Spa debarcle into the equation too...

Also there is a a real possibility below "the Championship" of a consistant podium-placed driver being demoted down the ranks in favour of a "Lucky" driver with one win (Monaco in the rain anyone?) and what effect that on the teams standings? (or will that be judged on size of motorhomes and hospitality suites?)

 

Critcal, you will find that Honda stopped the development of their 08 car before the 1/2 way point and dived into the '09 car which Braun GP have inherited, plus all their work was done pre-testing ban so this situation is more than likely... However we all know that "some teams" have their own private test track (or two) what's to stop them testing a "2010" car and hey presto suddenly these parts appear mid season!

[Philmo 0]

Well yes there is a possibility of recurrence of Mansell's 90's achievement and Shuey nearly repeated that feat - but the odds on a repeat are v slim following all the tech changes and the speed with which "in season" development takes place these days.

But ask yourself, do you follow F1 for the culmination of a final race result for team & driver or like me do you enjoy both the tech development as the season opens & unfolds, together with each individual race performance?

Yes you get a warm glow from being associated with the nationalities of driver & team which succeed but when all's said & done, isn't that aspect really just one big sponsor/media fest? :ignore:

Ironically Bernie's pushed for the scoring change over 2 seasons and his declared reason for it was to avoid arrival at ultimate/penultimate races with season's winners already identified! [Who said Brazilian's aren't exciting??!]

[Critical_Mass 10]

Critcal, you will find that Honda stopped the development of their 08 car before the 1/2 way point and dived into the '09 car which Braun GP have inherited, plus all their work was done pre-testing ban so this situation is more than likely... However we all know that "some teams" have their own private test track (or two) what's to stop them testing a "2010" car and hey presto suddenly these parts appear mid season!

 

True. I didnt know that 'Honda' had improved so much from their previous car. I retract my previous statement. But still wait before i make any sort of prediction regarding the front runners.

 

Only 9 days to go :dance:

[vwdeviant 0]

Amazing, looking at Bernie's history,

 

1958... 1 season of GP as an owner/driver, 2 Actual GP entries ... and DNQ both times.... and the Circuits are?

 

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Silverstone and Monaco, his two "least Favorite" one! :norty:

[The_Dude 0]

Amazing, looking at Bernie's history,

 

1958... 1 season of GP as an owner/driver, 2 Actual GP entries ... and DNQ both times

 

 

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! No wonder he has such an attitude problem. The man is a fool.

[vwdeviant 0]

Amazing, looking at Bernie's history,

 

1958... 1 season of GP as an owner/driver, 2 Actual GP entries ... and DNQ both times

 

 

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! No wonder he has such an attitude problem. The man is a fool.

 

 

We'll ignore the time he apparently ended up in Brands Hatch's carpark during an F3 race then! :ignore:

[The_Dude 0]

 

We'll ignore the time he apparently ended up in Brands Hatch's carpark during an F3 race then! :ignore:

 

 

*checks under desk to see if Jon is pulling leg* Noooo, really? I'm assuming as you said apparently there's no video or photo evidence?

[vwdeviant 0]

Hot from Wiki...

 

Early life

Ecclestone was born in St Peter South Elmham, a small hamlet three miles south of Bungay, Suffolk. Shortly thereafter his family moved to Bexleyheath, Kent, now a part of Greater London, and Ecclestone left school at the age of 16 to work at the local gasworks, and to pursue his hobby of motorcycles. Immediately after the end of World War II, Ecclestone went into business trading in spare parts for motorcycles, and formed the Compton & Ecclestone motorcycle dealership with Fred Compton. His first racing experience came in 1949 in the 500cc Formula 3 Series, acquiring a Cooper Mk V in 1951. He only drove a limited number of races, mainly at his local circuit, Brands Hatch but achieved a number of good placings and an occasional win[1]. His aspirations took a knock when he collided with Bill Whitehouse and landed in the car park on the outside of the track. Eventually, commercial pressures and the risks persuaded him to retire from the cockpit

[corozin 0]

Amazing, looking at Bernie's history,

1958... 1 season of GP as an owner/driver, 2 Actual GP entries ... and DNQ both times

 

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! No wonder he has such an attitude problem. The man is a fool.

We'll ignore the time he apparently ended up in Brands Hatch's carpark during an F3 race then! :ignore:

 

That's not either fair or accurate. Ecclestone bought and ran the Brabham Team successfully for many years including the season when Nelson Piquet won the world championship. I don't think that anyone would argue that commercially F1 has blossomed since he got involved in it's management in the mid-1980s.

 

But that doesn't change the fact that this is a stupid rule change. Sometimes I think Bernie dreams these things up just to provoke the team owners into revealing thier positions on other more important things. He's maintained his grip over F1 for over 20 years by dividing and manipulating the teams with considerable skill. This *could* just be another ruse.. or it could even just be a cheap way of getting F1 talked about 2 weeks before the season starts...

[vornwend 0]

Maybe Bernie is not thinking straight at the moment as he's facing the prospect of handing over $1 Billion dollars to his ex wife who apparently got a divorce granted without Bernie even being aware of it :lol:

 

I agree this is a silly rule change that could have unintended consequences and will devalue the efforts of potential champions who have fine races but don't finish 1st. Think of the number of times we have seen drivers bust a gut to get from way back on the grid into points positions or who are unfairly impeded and then make it up through brilliant driving.

[Toad 0]

I'm having a meal with a Williams F1 team employee tonight. All I've discovered is that he doesn't like it when I flash.

[corozin 0]

I'm having a meal with a Williams F1 team employee tonight. All I've discovered is that he doesn't like it when I flash.

That must qualify for post of the month. I almost died laughing at that.

[Philmo 0]

I'm having a meal with a Williams F1 team employee tonight. All I've discovered is that he doesn't like it when I flash.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

You mean F1 cars must now have headlights?!

[Wendy 0]

Assinate Bernie - is all I can say - and why didn't someone do it yonks ago.

 

Ferrari probably came up with the idea of the rule changes and we all knows who pulls Bernie's strings !! :)

[corozin 0]

Assinate Bernie - is all I can say - and why didn't someone do it yonks ago.

Ferrari probably came up with the idea of the rule changes and we all knows who pulls Bernie's strings !! :)

I think there are people who would argue that Bernie's appalling haircut alone should be grounds for knocking him off. I've seen street beggers who comb thier hair.

[vwdeviant 0]

Amazing, looking at Bernie's history,

1958... 1 season of GP as an owner/driver, 2 Actual GP entries ... and DNQ both times

 

 

We'll ignore the time he apparently ended up in Brands Hatch's carpark during an F3 race then! :ignore:

 

That's not either fair or accurate. Ecclestone bought and ran the Brabham Team successfully for many years including the season when Nelson Piquet won the world championship. I don't think that anyone would argue that commercially F1 has blossomed since he got involved in it's management in the mid-1980s.

 

Yeah OK so I "condensed" it a little John! But maybe goes some way to his apprent hatred of what is really the only decent venue here in the UK, Silverstone? :shrug:

 

Anyway we all know Bernie has some pretty "Mad" ideas... "The Brabham Fan Car" anyone? Mostly brought about because he signed a deal with Alfa to run their (Heavy) flat 12's in the ground effect years... which is when I really started following F1, Jones was the first driver who really got my attention.

 

He has some good ideas too... like Nelson Piquet...

 

Just makes me angry to see a 'sport' run in such a political way (and yes F1's more a business now)...

 

 

Anyway back to the main points of this discussion....

 

I hope Braun GP whip ass (at least early on)....

 

 

and

 

 

 

Massa's a hamster! :lol:

[corozin 0]

Yeah OK so I "condensed" it a little John! But maybe goes some way to his apprent hatred of what is really the only decent venue here in the UK, Silverstone? :shrug:

Anyway we all know Bernie has some pretty "Mad" ideas... "The Brabham Fan Car" anyone? Mostly brought about because he signed a deal with Alfa to run their (Heavy) flat 12's in the ground effect years... which is when I really started following F1, Jones was the first driver who really got my attention.

 

He has some good ideas too... like Nelson Piquet...

Just makes me angry to see a 'sport' run in such a political way (and yes F1's more a business now)...

 

Anyway back to the main points of this discussion....

I hope Braun GP whip ass (at least early on).... and

 

Massa's a hamster! :lol:

My apologies if that appeared as a 'pop' at you as that certainly wasn't my intention. It's perhaps inevitable that someone with largely executive powers over the way F1 is run and marketed will cause controversy by the very nature of the way he runs the operation. After all you ain't going to make everyone happy all the time. For what it's worth I think he's done a fairly good job of controlling the political influences that the various manufacturers, teams, governments and sponsors try to exert on the sport over the years. Ferrari's alleged "favouritism" in F1 is more a result of FIA decisions in my opinion.

 

That said, it does seem that Bernie's decision processes (particularly with regard to the circuits) is tinted not by what the Teams, Manufacturers or (mostly european based) fans want, but by what deals can be made which enhance his own considerable personal wealth. His long standing spat with Silverstone is merely an extension of the one he had prior to that with Brands Hatch in the late 1980s. In both cases his ambition was to gain control of the circuits themselves, and it is the BRDC's refusal to cave in which has resulted in the British GP being moved to Donington Park, in the same way that Bernie moved it from Brands to Silverstone when they refused to sell to him. Many people would say the same selection process is true with regard to the Singapore and Valencia rounds which appeared in 2008 - both cases where local Governments were desperate to pay whatever and whoever it took to get exposure. That's a nice little earner for his company.

 

But to address your last point is does seem as though the Brawn (ex-Honda) team have been dominating the pre season testing times so far. With the drastically new configurations of the cars this year I don't think any team has had the space to be doing any sandbagging (except perhaps the unexpected poor performance of the MacLaren team) so it could well be a very interesting first couple of races. Personally I'd also like to see Jenson Button grab a few wins as he's clearly a quick enough driver to win races.

 

john

[vwdeviant 0]

Schumy was quoted as thinking the new "Win" system is a mistake as well today...

 

So all we need is for Massa or Kimmi to look like they won't make the championship and hey-presto back to the old system! :hitler:

 

 

I can see the reasoning, but why not just make the points gap between 1st & 2nd bigger?

[Toad 0]

The Honda car isn't fulfilling the new requirements, the car that has set the times would not be allowed to race...

 

That must qualify for post of the month. I almost died laughing at that.

 

Hehe. :D The thing is, that post is entirely true. :)

[vwdeviant 0]

The Honda car isn't fulfilling the new requirements, the car that has set the times would not be allowed to race...

 

That must qualify for post of the month. I almost died laughing at that.

 

Hehe. :D The thing is, that post is entirely true. :)

 

 

Tell us more Tom... about the Braun car not your flashing!