VR6 will not run when hot, why???

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Well I never knew alternators were used as rev counters! You learn something every day!

[Rpmayne 0]

Well the sensor wasn't the problem, and it does it when cold now. Just got back from being towed again :(

 

Finished work, tried to start car, turns over but not firing and I could smell unburnt petrol again. Jacked the car up and changed the sensor (keep all my tools in the car now, feel like I've bought an Italian car). Turned it over and it ran. Thought wicked, shut the bonnet, put the tools away and it stalled. Started again and went for it.. got about 500yds down the road and nothing. "Hello, me again, any chance of a tow?".

 

This time the rev counter died. Should have be doing about 2000rpm, let the clutch up in gear, engine turning but now revs reading.

 

Now sitting on my drive f**cked again. :x Thinking about towing it into the garden and planting a tree in it, except the sunroof probably wouldn't bloody open.

 

By far the worst car I have ever bought, and getting worse! :cry:

[Kevin Bacon 5]

I think in your case mate you've bought a Cor-ha ha-do cause your motor is seriously taking the piss out of you mate. I'd have kicked and thrown things at it long ago!!

 

I think you need to start doing some continuity checks of your wiring looms. Unplug the ECU plug, pull back the rubber boot so it exposes the wiring codes and then match the codes and do some end-to-end connectivity tests with a meter or something.

 

So we've got fuel. Have we got sparks?

 

What could bomb out after a couple of mins driving? Changed your ECU and fuel pump relays? Think it's 109 and 67.

 

K

[ZIG HIEL!!!!! 0]

It sounds silly but have you checked theres plenty of back pressure coming from your exhaust end cause i had kinda the same problem car would start normally when it was cold but as soon as i took it for a run it wouldnt start at all :( wouldnt hurt to check hope it helps :mrgreen:

[Rpmayne 0]

Checked the exhaust cheers mate. Found the middle joint was loose, tightened but no difference. Took the car up to the Bosch garage for diagnostics, they phoned us 2 days later telling me to tow it away because its now mechanically jammed. Can be wound back abit by the crank but locks up at a certain point. :shock: Oh s**t me thinks, the plan is now to buy a B-reg 316 and take the thing apart again once I've calmed down abit. :x Sounded lovely aswell for the rare occasions when it ran.

 

What do you recon now, break it and sell the bits which work or sell the whole car once working? Or take an angle grinder to it and post the results on the forum... The latter is very tempting :evil:

[dr_mat 0]

Jeez! Well, I'll have the aux belt tensioner...

 

(Sorry, couldn't resist.. ;) )

[Kevin Bacon 5]

The only way it can jam mechanically is if you've got valves hitting pistons...... maybe the cam jumped a few teeth if it wasn't tensioned properly? Or perhaps the head gasket has leaked and has hydraulic'd a cylinder? Injector leaking causing a hydraulic lock?

 

After all you've done, it would be a shame to give up now :cry:

 

Think of it as a nice challenge and not a problem :wink:

[Rpmayne 0]

Can't really see how the chains could have jumped.. Its a ratchet bottom end which I pushed out to tension and the top is one of those oil pressure things.. Unless that is knackard cos its one bit i didn't change.

 

If I take the plugs out and try then, if it turns ok its hydraulic lock yer? Then head off to check.

 

Haven't looked at it myself yet, studying is suffering badly so going to catch up then have another look in a while. Cheers for the encouragement, lifes a game and all that.

[Rpmayne 0]

Had a thought about this problem I thought I would run past you all..

 

When the car went to the garage, they tried running it and it sounded like a tank, apparently from the cam area. Second time starting it was purring then stalled with what they describe as a 'not so good' noise. They then tried to turn it over by hand on the crank and it locks up mid rotation.

 

When changing the crank sensor there was some very fine metal filings on it. I flushed and changed the oil and filter. About 100 miles later I removed the sensor again and found more metal filings.

 

The question is... Could these filings be blocking up the hydraulic lifters and upper chain tensioner so causing the cam noise, and then resulting second time in the cam chain jumping so locking a valve with a cylinder?

 

I'm abit stuck here because I don't really want to take it apart unless I have a good idea whats happened. What could wear to cause the filings?

 

Thanks for any thoughts.

 

PS. Just found out today the 316 run around has a blown head gasket, :mad: Thats going back to the garage this afternoon, didn't really feel like taking that on aswell.

[Geo 0]

The crank sensor picks it's signal up from the flywheel doesn't it??? Therefore it's nowhere near the internals of the engine so that would have nothing to do with it at all. Those metal filings were probably from the clutch...

[PhatVR6 0]

What aload of sh1t!! the clutch isn't even in the fecking engine.

 

The crank sensor has a magnet in it. if it's picking up filing, then they are coimg out of your engine somewhere and floating around in your oil, which is NOT a good sign at all.

 

it sounds to me like you timing has jumped a fe teeth out because you didn't change the upper tensioner.

 

I'm afraid you'll have to take the head off and have a look at what damage has been caused.

[dr_mat 0]

..but of course start by lifting the cam cover and checking the cam timing, to see if that's a possible.

[v-dub-vr6 0]

alright

New to this site and have read all of your posts, am really intrested in the vr6 stalling as mine does it too.

I find with mine as slowing down to junctions etc it stalls, then turn the electrics on and i should get a short burst of fuel from the pump but am not, it constantly buzz's so i have to keep turn the ignition electrics on and off untill it stops and then the engine will start. But somtimes i have to leave it for a bit cos it floods itself. Can any one help pleeeeeeease.

oh yes took it to VW for dianostic check that said hall sender so changed the coil pack was good for a week then shit again. HELP! :x

[Kevin Bacon 5]

If your VR keeps stalling, replace the idle valve.

 

Another thing the VR responds well too is a clean up of the throttle body internally and also a cleanup of the idle valve.

 

If you're really struggling, you can adjust the throttle stop to raise the idle a bit or you can try moving the throttle damper further up the threads by undoing the 13mm nut underneath and adjusting it.

 

When it stalls out, just turn the key round to position 1, then back round to 3 to restart. Don't bump it, the chains don't like that.

 

Hall sender is the cam position sensor, you shouldn't have to replace the coilpack for that!

 

K

[PhatVR6 0]

Mine ws stalling becasue I'd backed off the throttle damper. the revs were dropping so fast when I shut off the throttle that the ISV didn't have time to kick in. With the dampers et right it should just catch the throttle for a split second and shut the butterfly slowly so the ISV has time to take over the idling.

 

If your fuel pump rns constantly there is a problem. the ecu controls the fuel pump. but I've seen people bodge conversions and wire them so they run with the ignition. check round the back of the fuseboard ofr a yellow and blue wire, and a yellow and green wire and a big yellow connector joinng the 2. make sure nothing looks out of place.

[v-dub-vr6 0]

I changed the coil pack cos vw say the hall sender is inside it, and i didnt see the point of spending loads of time stripping that down so i just replaced the whole thing, it looked abit shoddy anyway. ive also already cleaned the idle valve up and it was fine. I think i'll try fidiling with the wires behind the fuse board cos it is in a right shit state behind there could be that. thanks.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

There's no hall sender in the coilpack. You must have an early distributor VR as they use hall senders. Late VRs use a cam position sensor bolted to the chain cover.

[v-dub-vr6 0]

I dunno its a 1995 M reg vr6

[v-dub-vr6 0]

hello again, i had a look at the fuse board nothing seemed out of place though any more suggestions pleaes

[v-dub-vr6 0]

oh yeah and its not starting at all now! bastard thing :cry:

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Crank sensor

[weegaz22 0]

when i worked as a renualt mechanic we had a few cars come in with similar problems, car would cut out when hot, we traced it down to the crank sensor which would run fine when cold, but the heat from the engine would raise the resistance in the sensor making it stall the engine, so i would think about replacing it if you are running out of options

[Kevin Bacon 5]

£140 :(

[v-dub-vr6 0]

crank sensor yeah, alright i'll give that a whirl then. My mechanic said about sending the ecu away for testing, Could it be that? cos its not starting at all anymore!

[dr_mat 0]

As a general rule, if VAG-COM (or equivalent) can talk to the ECU, then the ECU is fine...

And if VAG-COM says that it's not getting a sensible signal from the crank position sensor when you turn the engine over, then the CPS is at fault..