Forged Pistons?

[Geeba 0]

Anyone running forged pistons in their VR?

 

Just curious on experience with them? Piston slap? Clatter? What brand? Etc.

[g0ldf1ng3r 13]

Anyone running forged pistons in their VR?

 

Just curious on experience with them? Piston slap? Clatter? What brand? Etc.

 

i know i have a brand in my brain somewhere but cant bloody locate it lol

 

try dropping Kev Bacon a PM m8, i am pretty sure he will know lots that you want to understand & likely more ;)

 

AFIK they would normally looked at as an option if you currently have piston slap - as they would be to uprate slightly to a true 3 litre & in combination with a block re-bore & re-hone to remove any ovaling & cater for the oversized piston compared to OE

[MikeVR6 0]

I have Wossner pistons and Conrods in mine. It's also been re-bored. Don't ask me any technical questions as I haven't a clue. But beyond the normal whir of the aux belts and pulleys, my VR6 sounds fine.

Kev Bacon or indeed Vince at Stealth Racing will have supreme Techie knowledge :)

Edited December 5, 2017 by MikeVR6

[g0ldf1ng3r 13]

I have Woessner pistons and Conrods in mine. It's also been re-bored. Don't ask me any technical questions as I haven't a clue. But beyond the normal whir of the aux belts and pulleys, my VR6 sounds fine.

Kev Bacon or indeed Vince at Stealth Racing will have supreme Techie knowledge :)

 

ahhh haaaa

 

that's the puppy MikeVR6!!! Wossner 3 litres, as soon as i read your post it clanged lol

Edited November 23, 2017 by g0ldf1ng3r

[Dox 22]

Wossner, J E and Wiseco have all made oversize pistons in the past. I think I’ve read that the weights can differ between brands?

[fla 9]

mahle also do them

[swiftkid 1]

As above, Wossner is the usual one I head of for VR's. I read a while ago Kev saying his used to rattle a bit on startup but as far as I'm aware thats to be expected. Oil choice is a big one as you can't just slap any old rubbish in. What are you looking to achieve? High compression for N/A, low compression for turbo or just boring it out?

 

If its just boring it out, there was a guy selling a set on here a while ago and when you added everything up, the cost of going 3.0 compared to the power you get wasn't that great. Obviously turbo/charger applications are different but that's n/a

[Geeba 0]

Morning all,

 

Sorry for the delay - work don't seem to appreciate I have an engine and car build going on! :D

 

The reason for the forged pistons is whilst I was doing an auto to manual conversion I decided to give the engine a once over... when I say once over it's turned into a full rebuild.

 

The block went off for a hone, rings, full balance etc. but on inspection there was a little wear on a couple of the bores so the decision was made to use 82.5mm Mahle items as I knew there were little gains in huge costing overbores...

 

The mahle items were then discovered to be on back order at the manufactures... 6 weeks... bear in mind this was the end of July.. or they could source Wiseco's in three days and only a few quid extra... ok cool.

 

Then the Wisco's were only available in 83mm... ok cool bore it to that.

 

All good.... no

 

The Wiseco's turned up as 9.0:1 - we're at the second week in October by now... ok order up the 10.0:1's - cool... errr no they turned up again as 9.0:1's

 

So now I'm a little bit miffed as they seem to be struggling to find pistons... and if I'd know we were going 83mm in the first place I'd of gone the whole hog and had 83.5's and had a 3.0l block.

 

So I'm trying to find something the machine shop can source that are suitable... I was just wondering if there was any that were a complete "no-no" in the VR lump really.

 

Yeah Kev is a wealth of information, I've been annoying him on PM's for ages now! LOL! ;)

 

I've also read that forged pistons can slap and clatter - I was trying to keep the car reasonably OE+ so was a little worried on that front, but relived to know others are running them with no issues.

Edited December 5, 2017 by Geeba

[Geeba 0]

Sorted!

 

10.5:1 Wiseco.

[Geeba 0]

Sorted!

 

10.5:1 Wiseco.

Need to get an update done on my build thread.. done loads..

 

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

[delfinis38 1]

Looking good giles :)

[Geeba 0]

Looking good giles :)

 

Morning

 

Yes its coming along now, block has been decked, bored, cleaned and painted, crank, rods and flywheel have all been balanced.. all the aluminum parts and the gearbox casings have gone off for aqua-blasting, should look like new ;)

 

Engine bay is painted and I've started re-wrapping the loom... got more stuff heading to the powder coaters... hope to have the front end back on the ground soon.. once all the new suspension turns up ;)

 

Then I'll start on the back end.

[Cressa 43]

Damn your engine looks sooo good. Keep posting the pics mate

 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[Geeba 0]

Hmmmm am I pushing it here....

 

Block has been decked... cylinder head has been skimmed - both only to clean them up for the MK4 MLS head gasket I had intended to use...

 

But the VR as far as I understand runs a negative deck... ie the pistons raise above the block and the quench pads rely on the head gasket to avoid a coming together with the head... this combined with SM 263 cams... hmmmm am I pushing my luck?

 

The new pistons are 10.5:1 - anyone else been done this path?

[MikeVR6 0]

Did you call Vince @ Stealth Racing?

I'm sure he'll be happy to give you advice.

 

Mine uses Schimmel 264 cams (I think) and looking at the parts list I see Wossner Conrods and 82.5mm Pistons.

 

- Forged Conrods and 82.5mm Low Compression Pistons (Woessner-kolben.de)

 

- Steel head gasket

 

- ARP strengthened cylinder head bolts

 

- "Helix" Race Clutch & strengthened Clutch Arm

- Main Crank and Big End Bearings

 

- Mocal 13 row Oil Cooler and fitting kit

 

- Vibratech strengthened front engine mount

 

- Fan Switch and Thermostat

 

*** Mine was built for LOWER Compression though, as I was also fitting a Charger ***

Edited December 7, 2017 by MikeVR6

[Geeba 0]

Damn your engine looks sooo good. Keep posting the pics mate

 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

Cheers Cressa ;)

 

Its really starting to take shape now... really pleased with it, should be a good example with my level of OCD once done, everything will ether be new or re

 

I'll get an update in my build thread as soon as I can - I've taken loads of pictures but Photobucket knocked the wind out of my sails and I find tapatalk a bit of a drag.

[Geeba 0]

Did you call Vince @ Stealth Racing?

I'm sure he'll be happy to give you advice.

 

Mine uses Schimmel 264 cams (I think) and looking at the parts list I see Wossner Conrods and 82.5mm Pistons.

 

- Forged Conrods and 82.5mm Low Compression Pistons (Woessner-kolben.de)

 

- Steel head gasket

 

- ARP strengthened cylinder head bolts

 

- "Helix" Race Clutch & strengthened Clutch Arm

- Main Crank and Big End Bearings

 

- Mocal 13 row Oil Cooler and fitting kit

 

- Vibratech strengthened front engine mount

 

- Fan Switch and Thermostat

 

Cheers Mike... sounds like you're forced induction thou?

 

Yeah I might give Vince a call... last time I spoke to him I hadn't got the pistons...

[Dox 22]

http://clubgti.com/showthread.php?285724-Toyotec-s-debunking-the-myth-about-12v-VR6-MLS-and-fibre-AAA-and-AMY-head-gaskets&highlight=toyotech+vr6+myths

 

Not sure if the charts in this thread are any help?

[Geeba 0]

http://clubgti.com/showthread.php?285724-Toyotec-s-debunking-the-myth-about-12v-VR6-MLS-and-fibre-AAA-and-AMY-head-gaskets&highlight=toyotech+vr6+myths

 

Not sure if the charts in this thread are any help?

 

Hiya Dox

 

Yeah I did have a read through these... but when I speak to tuners and engine builders they say it does have an impact... so I was bit torn on what to do..

 

With the block decked and the 10.5 ratio pistons I was hoping to get to almost 11.0 with the extra from the block shave and MSL gasket... Hmmmmmm decision... :s

Edited December 7, 2017 by Geeba

[Geeba 0]

http://clubgti.com/showthread.php?285724-Toyotec-s-debunking-the-myth-about-12v-VR6-MLS-and-fibre-AAA-and-AMY-head-gaskets&highlight=toyotech+vr6+myths

 

Not sure if the charts in this thread are any help?

Had a measure up at the weekend... I'm not sure what gaskets he's using bit the MLS is incredibly thin... just by looking at it you can see and then feel how thin it is.

First the new fibre gasket

then the MLS

 

These are both Elring gaskets, unused and un-crushed, but I understand after crushing the MLS is 0.6mm and the fibre will be 1.6mm so 1mm of difference... that's pretty substantial. there's absolutely no way the difference in thickness is 0.05mm as the fella had used in his calculations.

 

With the block being decked I was concerned about the squish hitting the head the MLS really is that thin.

 

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Edited December 12, 2017 by Geeba