ABS upgrade

[st4stokie 10]

Has anyone upgraded the ABS unit on their Corrado. I'm told the the MK3 golf one will fit (part no. 1H2614117B) with some modifications to the loom etc but I'm after a how to on it if possible. Can't find anything in the searches.

Reason for this is I'm fitting a bam engine and want the brakes to back up the power increase. I'll be fitting bigger 312mm front and 256mm rears from the donor as well

[Simeon 0]

The best upgrade is to remove it completely I reckon.

 

Otherwise I believe you want to search for 'Teves 20' upgrade

 

http://the-corrado.net/showthread.php?84928-TEVES-20-ABS-system-parts-list

[swiftkid 1]

The best upgrade is to remove it completely I reckon.

 

Otherwise I believe you want to search for 'Teves 20' upgrade

 

http://the-corrado.net/showthread.php?84928-TEVES-20-ABS-system-parts-list

 

I'm sorry but that is the worst advice I have ever heard. Putting aside the fact that removing the ABS system from a car originally fitted with ABS is now MOT fail-able, it's just plain stupid to simply remove it and expect your brakes to be better.

 

Yes, the mk3 golf teves20 system fits as per the above link, your best bet is finding a late passat b4 with ABS and take everything off that otherwise you need to do some cutting, splicing and lengthening of loom to get it to fit. Sadly finding a late Passat B4 with ABS is quite rare these days. As you'll be fitting a 1.8t I presume you'll be using a 'stubby' master cylinder from an Ibiza Cupra which is a larger piston, that should improve the braking. Have a look on club gti about focus master cylinder, they are the same as cupra ones as a fraction of the price, they just need a little tweak to fit them.

 

Also, hopefully you are not taking out a 6 pot to put a 4 pot in (judging from the 256mm rear brake comment its a valver), so you'll be able to upgrade to a 9" servo, or use the Teves20 servo.

 

Lastly, decent brake fluid and braided lines will help get a decent brake pedal. I've done all of the above and brakes are good, but brake pads let the whole system down at the moment.

[fendervg 33]

AFAIK - if there is not a trace of the previous ABS system to be seen, i.e it has been removed completely, it will not be a fail. I've heard of passes where just the ABS light has been removed, but wouldn't chance it.

 

Teves 20 is a good bet, but hard to find at this stage. It won't give you much better braking though, just more reliable ABS with easier parts availability. Just replacing or refurbishing the brake master on these cars makes a huge difference as the one that's there will be 20-25 yrs old and the seals will be weeping.

 

There was a long discussion about this on here before, and the consensus was that you will never get a modern brake pedal feel on a Corrado without a lot of work and fabrication to the pedal, cylinder and servo as it's a matter of the mechanical advantage provided by the position of the pedal acting on the cylinder which is different.

[Simeon 0]

I'm sorry but that is the worst advice I have ever heard. Putting aside the fact that removing the ABS system from a car originally fitted with ABS is now MOT fail-able, it's just plain stupid to simply remove it and expect your brakes to be better.

 

Speaking of bad advice ... if there's nothing there there's nothing to fail.

 

Personally not a fan of ABS on these old cars, each to their own

[st4stokie 10]

It's a 2.0 8v I'm converting. It's got a 9" servo and I've got an Ibiza stubby for clearance. I'll look into the teves20 thread. Thanks for the replies

[fendervg 33]

The 2.0 8v system shouldn't be that bad - it's a more reliable systems than the VR6, which is where most of the trouble lies. Do you have an all in one ABS pump and master cylinder assembly?

[st4stokie 10]

It's sperate like the VR6 not sure how to post a picture on here to show how it looks

[Keyo 47]

Got to say Im no expert on this matter but a lighter Corrado with a four cylinder block is not that much difference then a Mk2 Golf which the majority had no ABS I believe, so maybe not a bad call to remove the abs system because there are so many damn thighs to go wrong. In regards to the VR much heavier and more power so it would probably be a bad idea to remove.

 

On another note My VR passed with no advisories today so very happy that have a years green card.

[swiftkid 1]

Speaking of bad advice ... if there's nothing there there's nothing to fail.

 

Personally not a fan of ABS on these old cars, each to their own

 

You can not be serious? You're calling my factual information bad advice? Based on the FACT my friend removed his abs system and ended up having to scrap the car because he failed MOT and couldn't be arsed to mess around any more, that's pretty sound advice. I agree that if you remove it in it's entirety and make everything it should pass but it's only recently this regulation has come, not sure if you got an MOT man who knows the car should have the system he could fail it.

 

Having driven with stock ABS teves02 system, teves20 and no ABS I know what I prefer. Anchoring on with both front wheels locked & absolutely no ABS assistance isn't my idea of fun.

[nelik 10]

pewpew shots fired..

I removed the Teves02 and installed Teves20 in my VR6 some years ago. Teves02 is not reliable, as I did a semi hard break to not hit a deer the oil pump cracked.

Did not see this until the morning after and the whole driveway was full of oil. Never got it to work properly after that even with a new pump installed at VAG.

 

The Teves20 is a 4-way system and not 3 with a breaking force regulator that tend to lock up, Teves20 is better in my opinion.

Only problem I had while installing was to get the ABS light to work as the only electrical scheme I could find was in russian.. The B4 Passat ABS light electronics fits the oem housing but the MK3 does not.

The break booster from Passat fits straight on, and you need the mounting plate to go with it. If you go with the MK3 booster you need to cut and weld or modify it in some way as it has a ball in the end.

And you need to change the rear ABS sensors as the OEM is to slow, think I got mine from a Polo. Aaand you need another clutch master cylinder, oem wont fit as it's to long.

The master clutch cylinder needs to be mounted on the mounting plate before the break booster! I learned this the hard way..

 

If you go this route try find a whole kit for sale on German ebay or something, from a B4 Passat.

[stuarttaylor37 13]

There is a Passat breaker on FB with the seller asking £2oo for the whole teves 20 system

Edited October 21, 2019 by stuarttaylor37

[stuarttaylor37 13]

It won't give you much better braking though, just more reliable ABS with easier parts availability.

I have both on two different cars, believe me there is a significant difference

[Simeon 0]

You can not be serious? You're calling my factual information bad advice? Based on the FACT my friend removed his abs system and ended up having to scrap the car because he failed MOT and couldn't be arsed to mess around any more, that's pretty sound advice. I agree that if you remove it in it's entirety and make everything it should pass but it's only recently this regulation has come, not sure if you got an MOT man who knows the car should have the system he could fail it.

 

Having driven with stock ABS teves02 system, teves20 and no ABS I know what I prefer. Anchoring on with both front wheels locked & absolutely no ABS assistance isn't my idea of fun.

 

Mate, you've got to laugh, you've said you've provided factual information [note I'm only talking about the MOT fail part], then totally contradicted yourself to agree with me. The rules haven't changed, they can only test what's there, as you yourself have stated, if it's not fitted they can't test it therefore it cannot fail.

 

No where have I suggested non-abs brakes are better, I have simply stated a preference, particularly on cars where the ABS is rarely functioning anyway in addition I provided the OP with more information to help his search plus a link to relevant thread to upgrade to a newer better system, per his original question.

[swiftkid 1]

I'll put this nice and simple.

 

FACT

-An MOT man can and will fail MOT if ALL traces of the ABS have not been removed, this includes sensors, wiring, dash lights, ECU. That is not opinion, that is fact.

-My mate removed the MOT but left traces of it, his car failed

 

Contradiction you say?

 

OPINION

-It's a stupid idea to remove the ABS system, it's not a great system but Rome wasn't built in a day and everyone had to start somewhere.

-In my opinion, rather than going backwards and removing things because they aren't very good, move forward and upgrade. Headlight looms, brakes, suspension. I can go on.

 

Apologies from a grumpy man, I didn't intend to start an argument but I've seen soo many people recently on failbook asking how to remove everything from anything that makes things function correctly, things as stupid as lambda sensors, MAF's, water pumps, power steering, all in the name of "smoothing" and it's got my back up.

[fendervg 33]

I think the consensus is that a working ABS system is better than just hydraulic and no ABS is better than no brakes!

 

The Teves 20 is slightly better than 02/04, but mainly because it's more reliable and easier to work on. I've driven Passats and Mk3s with the latter and there is very little improvement over a well set up and refurbished standard VR6 system - the Mk4 and 5 systems are a vast improvement.

 

If you plan on a full resto or strip down, then it makes sense to upgrade if you can get hold of the parts, but don't expect miracles. As I said earlier, I think if you replace or refurbish the master cylinder and make sure that there are no leaks from the servo and piping, a lot of the sponginess we are used to goes away. Problem is that you can't get the master cylinders new any more.

[fendervg 33]

I'll put this nice and simple.

 

FACT

-An MOT man can and will fail MOT if ALL traces of the ABS have not been removed, this includes sensors, wiring, dash lights, ECU. That is not opinion, that is fact.

-My mate removed the MOT but left traces of it, his car failed

 

Contradiction you say?

 

OPINION

-It's a stupid idea to remove the ABS system, it's not a great system but Rome wasn't built in a day and everyone had to start somewhere.

-In my opinion, rather than going backwards and removing things because they aren't very good, move forward and upgrade. Headlight looms, brakes, suspension. I can go on.

 

Apologies from a grumpy man, I didn't intend to start an argument but I've seen soo many people recently on failbook asking how to remove everything from anything that makes things function correctly, things as stupid as lambda sensors, MAF's, water pumps, power steering, all in the name of "smoothing" and it's got my back up.

 

This is why I don't like FB!

[Kevin Bacon 5]

AFAIK - if there is not a trace of the previous ABS system to be seen, i.e it has been removed completely, it will not be a fail. I've heard of passes where just the ABS light has been removed, but wouldn't chance it.

 

Teves 20 is a good bet, but hard to find at this stage. It won't give you much better braking though, just more reliable ABS with easier parts availability. Just replacing or refurbishing the brake master on these cars makes a huge difference as the one that's there will be 20-25 yrs old and the seals will be weeping.

 

There was a long discussion about this on here before, and the consensus was that you will never get a modern brake pedal feel on a Corrado without a lot of work and fabrication to the pedal, cylinder and servo as it's a matter of the mechanical advantage provided by the position of the pedal acting on the cylinder which is different.

 

Yep, worth fitting the OBD2 Golf system just to bin off the proportioning valve and the now obsolete pedal position sensor.

 

Spot on with the pedal. The master cylinder fulcrum point is all wrong in the Corrado's pedal. It's too far down the pedal to offer any mechanical advantage as you say. Just means you have to push harder!

 

You could take the pedal assembly from a later Golf (MK4,5, 6 etc) and bolt that in. The TTRS master cylinder is about 25mm and the VR6's is 23 iirc? So another good use of modern parts!

 

Have you seen Project Binky on Youtube? Basically grafting an entire Celica GT4 running gear and engine into a BL Mini. That's what it's all about! Old and busted Corrado on the outside, new hotness inside and underneath.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

recently on failbook asking how to remove everything from anything that makes things function correctly, things as stupid as lambda sensors, MAF's, water pumps, power steering, all in the name of "smoothing" and it's got my back up.

 

 

I saw one from the MK5 GTI community where a chap removed his A/C system to fit a bigger intercooler, and then complained about being too hot last summer.

 

Double

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by Kevin Bacon