Another G60 HELP request! Start and idle problems!

[Tempest 0]

I have never been able to get to the bottom of my G60s start problems yet, so here's another request for help! :D

 

My G60 usually takes 2 attempts to start from cold before it'll stay idling. On the first attempt it splutters and usually dies.

 

You can cheat by disconnecting the blue temp-sensor, it'll start fine, then reconnect the temp-sensor (you can hear the revs drop a wee bit, indicating the wiring loom is OK), but yesterday I noticed severe idle hunting to the point that the engine nearly cut out whilst idling.

 

I restarted the engine and all was fine. When left for a few hours and I restart, everything is fine. Once running the G60 runs and pulls fine, as if there has never been a problem (would indicate that there is no problem with air leaks such as the hose to the ECU, I would have thought). It's just when starting from cold.

 

HELP!

 

I have done the following (all without success):

 

Changed the blue temp-sensor several times;

Changed the idle stabilisation valve several times, cleaned them (all 2nd hand parts, though), and yes, they tick/hum;

Checked the wiring loom to the ECU several times, all fine;

Fitted new lambda probe, new VR6-CAT;

Set the CO-Pot to 480 Ohms (was 515 Ohms, didn't make any difference);

Changed the fuel lines in the engine bay (no leaks);

Changed the stock FPR several times (new ones and used ones);

Cleaned all ground connections on wiring loom and ground points (incl. the ECU ground);

 

I am running a standard charger pulley, RS-outlet kit, have airco (US-spec), and running Zoran's chip (contains an extra map for 100 octane fuel), but the problem has started a long time after having run Zoran's chip, so rules out the chip.

 

Would I need a special ISV for airco-G60s? As so far all the replacement units have not exactly matched the part number of the original unit.

 

Any help appreciated, folks :-) as this is starting to really annoy me ;-)

 

Tempest

[Riley 0]

im not 100% on this,but i dont think it should start at all with the bts disconnected? :(

 

i know mine dosnt anyway,this is a bit of a wild guess but maybe a problem with the ecu?

 

like the 'starting while in service mode bit' is knackered or sommet if it even has one? :lol:

[Tempest 0]

Yeah, I had been thinking about changing the ECU, but according to Zoran on the German forum, there should be no problem starting a G60 with the BTS disconected. The ECU then assumes a temperature of 0°C, according to Zoran.

 

But changing the ECU is another possibility. There still is the issue with the correct ISV for a US-spec Rado with airco as mentioned above, though ...

 

Tempest

[VEEDUBBED 0]

Connect a mechanical fuel pressure gauge and check the pressure on cold start-up,mine did the same,when i first turned on the ignition the gauge barely moved,2nd attempt ditto,3rd time the pressure went up to required 3bar,tired fuel pump and possibly a faulty FPR.

[W3RKD 0]

Connect a mechanical fuel pressure gauge and check the pressure on cold start-up,mine did the same,when i first turned on the ignition the gauge barely moved,2nd attempt ditto,3rd time the pressure went up to required 3bar,tired fuel pump and possibly a faulty FPR.

 

A very worthwhile test... i have seen this problem occur a few times also..

[Tempest 0]

Any ideas where I can get a half-way decently priced and useful fuel pressure gauge from?

 

Reason I'm asking is I've failed for 6 months (yes, it's been that long that I've been looking for one ...) to find one in the UK. Google et al come up with that item from Draper, which seems to only go up to 30 psi, i.e. 2.07 bar :roll:

 

Will have to start looking abroad, I suppose.

 

Tempest

[VEEDUBBED 0]

Demon tweeks mate,i live in Rome,Italy,so if i get bits sent quite often by them it must say something about their 1st rate service,really exellent company that i fully recomend,i prefer mechanical gauges to electrical versions but in the event of a possible leak 1 could end up flame grilled....

[gibber 0]

I got my fuel gauge of ebay mate.

 

I should have my cabrio G60 (us spec) back next week if you want the part number ov my ISV?

[goodridge 0]

cabrio G60 (us spec)

 

Did I read that right???!!

[gibber 0]

goodridge off topic so pm'd you!

[Tempest 0]

OK, although there was an initially £10 fuel pressure gauge available on ebay yesterday (thanks to Henny for spotting that one, and Jim phoning me about it :-) ), it did shoot up to £100 : :shock:

 

Sooo, I went back, and voila, found another fuel pressure tester kit, this time by Crypton, which I managed to win today for still £73, but including all sorts of connectors as well. Hope they will fit my 2 Roccos' K-Jetronic as well. Right, let's see in what condition my latest ebay-win is going to be, subject to the usual ebay-challenges, I guess :lol:

 

Then I can start determining the fuel pressure on my G60 :-) Hopefully it'll reveal where the problem lies.

 

Tempest

[Critical_Mass 10]

Tempest mine has the exact same problem, wont cold-start first time, always takes two attempts. So youre all saying its a knackered fuel pump?

[stevemac 0]

Tempest, If you want to borrow a good FPR to test, I can lend you mine if you like ?

[Tempest 0]

Thanks Steve for the kind offer, but I've lready tried at least 3 FPRs, one of them being a brand-spanking new original VAG item from my stealers for £50, didn't cure the problem :cry: Then again, if you fancy having a look at mine, I could always come up one day to where your Rado-HQs are (i.e. home) :-), and could still try.

 

The problem is that the starting problem only ever occurs with a stone-cold engine that's been standing for at least a night. This morning again at Utterly Veedubberly, although my Rado started after the 1st key-turn, it did stutter for a few seconds (about 3), before the idle was smooth again, and all was well.

 

Tempest

[stevemac 0]

Tempest, You're always welcome at my house Eric. I'll be busy with another G60 engine rebuild/install next weekend but I'll be free the weekend after. I have a fully working G60 here (mine) - we could swap a few bits & hopefully get to the bottom of your running problems.

[Tempest 0]

Yeah, probably take you up on the offer, will have to be the weekend after the one you're free, as on that one, I have my Mum visiting me from Germany. Typical :roll: :lol:

 

Tempest

[Jim 2]

If i'm around, would love to tag along to learn / watch a bit.. well, if there is room that is! :)

[Blown 0]

Yeah, I had been thinking about changing the ECU, but according to Zoran on the German forum, there should be no problem starting a G60 with the BTS disconected. The ECU then assumes a temperature of 0°C, according to Zoran.

 

But changing the ECU is another possibility. There still is the issue with the correct ISV for a US-spec Rado with airco as mentioned above, though ...

 

Tempest

 

Well that's wierd.

I'm with Riley on this one-my G60 won't start or run with the bts disconnected...... :scratch:

[Tempest 0]

or run with the bts disconnected

 

That should be possibile, however, as how else would you set your idle speed and set the timing? Both require the BTS to be disconnected while the engine is running.

 

Jim, that shouldn't be a problem, you'll just see 2 blokes swapping FPRs, ISVs (already done that umpteen times, yawn, all to no avail), and whatnot :lol: Yes, I would have room to take you :-)

 

Tempest

[gibber 0]

No offence to riley but his car isnt running right so its probs not the best car to be comparing any running problems to!

 

Tempest I was ment to say I have just taken my fuel pressure gauge off my VR if you want to lend it, it is the tpye that T's into you fuel line. I could post it to you.

[Tempest 0]

Thanks for the offer, mate, but in my haste, I have already bought a full fuel pressure tester kit from Crypton on ebay over the weekend. Waiting for it to arrive ...

 

Tempest

[Jim 2]

On the plus side I know where Steve lives already so will point you in the right direction.. hopefully won't end up doing like I did when I went to his place last time, driving up and down the M6 after missing the turnoff and getting lost around Birmingham!! :)

[stevemac 0]

Sounds good to me Jim/Eric. Like I said, the only weekend that I'm busy at the mo is this coming one.

 

Just let me know a few days before you're coming & I'll organise myself at this end.

[Guest]

I have simlar problems in very cold weather or after i have left the car all night. she will start, but hunt for 10 secs.. could it simply be the blue temp sender on the way out?

 

Eric, did you get to the bottom of your problems?

[Majik 0]

Whats the condition of the distributor/cap rotor arm like, have you checked these?