Potential new engine...

[Henny 0]

Right, so, I've kinda been sat around thinking "what can I do to make my Corrado a little bit special once again, but this time with some decent fuel economy and reliability, yet still plenty of grin making potential"... :shrug:

 

I've been playing with the idea of all sorts of engines, but I think I've just made up my mind having seen the remap graph attached below... This is from a standard VW Engine, in a standard bay, with standard plugs, oil and paper filter that's just had a remap...

 

So, the point of this thread is to ask this question... Looking at the graph, and bearing in mind I'd pretty easily get another 10 to 20 horses outta it with some other tweaks I'd be doing (I'd be stripping and blue-printing/porting/polishing/gas-flowing/lightening EVERYTHING! :cuckoo: :help: ) before going onto messing with any forced induction stuff, do you reckon this'd be any good in a Corrado mated to a 6 speed 02S box? :shrug:

 

Oh, and I'm not going to tell you what it is yet... It could be the first of it's kind if I can find one and pull off the conversion.. :lol:

[mattnorgrove 0]

Nice figures! That much low down torque, it must be an oil burner?

[Reggit 0]

Gotta be a diesel?

[swiftkid 1]

Has to be a diesel! looking at the graphs if will be good, id think about heavy duty driveshafts and an lsd to put the power down with, otherwise your just going to be spinning.

[Gareth_16V 0]

It's not a diesel, it's going to 6700 RPM!

 

I'd say that it was too low for a 2.0 TFSI with a remap, so is it the 1.4 TSI twin-charged thingy from the Goof GT? Normally 170bhp?

 

Gareth

[weetos 0]

1.4 tsi nice figures no these

[Yandards 0]

Looks like a nice torque plot above 2500rpm but pretty flat below that.

 

I'm not going to comment on the engine type as I have forwarded something to Henny that gives the game away.

 

As for blue printing etc, I don't know what sort of gains you will get from that level of work on a modern block. If you look at the VR6 (first of the modern engines) then a full blue print etc usually produces very little power gain for a lot of work. I know you will be doing all of it bar the balancing yourself and I am interested to see how much you do manage.

[mattnorgrove 0]

1.4 tsi nice figures no these

 

If thats the torque from a standard 1.4 then i'm amazed!!

 

Corrado 1.4?!?! :camp:

 

:lol:

[Yandards 0]

1.4 tsi nice figures no these

 

If thats the torque from a standard 1.4 then i'm amazed!!

 

Corrado 1.4?!?! :camp:

 

:lol:

 

Stock 1.4 twin charger produces 125kW at 6k rpm and 240Nm of torque from 1750 to 4500 rpm.

[Supercharged 2]

Yep - looks like a 1.4 TSI to me - superb engine and about time someone fitted something nice and light to a Corrado and keep the 4cyl Handling as is should be.

[Danny B 0]

Yep - looks like a 1.4 TSI to me - superb engine and about time someone fitted something nice and light to a Corrado and keep the 4cyl Handling as is should be.

 

Yes when you put it like that its an interesting proposition isnt it !!

[Henny 0]

damnit... you guys are too quick... :brickwall: :grin: I thought it'd be a bit longer until you sussed that out... :?

 

Gareth_16V seems to have been first to guess it: 170bhp version of the 1.4TFSI twin-charged engine is the way I'm thinking of going...

 

only I may then do some other things to it... :nuts: I'm thinking of upping it to 1.6, using the G60 intercooler (the standard ones are, apparently, pants) and, as I said above, going to town with the blueprinting stick...

 

I reckon that with that little lot, it should be good for around 250bhp, 350Nm torque and at least 40mpg! :shock: 8)

Anyone know if anybody out there has done anything like this before? :shrug:

[Supercharged 2]

 

Yes when you put it like that its an interesting proposition isnt it !!

 

Indeed - I drove a Scirocco with the engine a couple of weeks ago and it's not slow at all - The Corrado weighs a lot less and handles better!

 

Henny - as far as I know no one has done this yet but it's exactly what I'd be looking at doing now as the price of Diesel is going up. You can get the engine manual and self study off ErWin if you've not already.

[mattnorgrove 0]

1.4 tsi nice figures no these

 

If thats the torque from a standard 1.4 then i'm amazed!!

 

Corrado 1.4?!?! :camp:

 

:lol:

 

Stock 1.4 twin charger produces 125kW at 6k rpm and 240Nm of torque from 1750 to 4500 rpm.

 

Very nice amount of torque! Consider my words eaten!!

 

So what's this "blueprinting" all about then?

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Looks like a nice torque plot above 2500rpm but pretty flat below that.

 

And flat after it aswell... torque falls 131nm from 2500 to 6700rpm, with a tiny flash of inspiration at 4000.

 

This is why I'm not a fan of the modern VAG diesels and petrol turbos. The fun is over almost as quickly as it arrived and with their torque strategy based mapping, the power delivery can be truly awful at times..... like our ME7.5 1.8T for example.....if for a moment the ECU suspects the wheels are going to spin, it cuts all turbo boost and closes the throttle, which if you're trying to join a motorway off a short slip road is fappin dangerous!

 

I do like the idea of a little 1.4 turbo in a corrado though. Small engine, high boost is looking like it's the way forward now because off boost economy can be diesel like......but...... is it what a Corrado is all about? Corrados to me are all about the 80s/90s sustained lunge to the red line. I'm 80s all the way. It's why I still have orange indicators and green interior lighting :D I don't think Corrados need these modern engines. Why do all Corrado owners who put 24Vs and 1.8Ts into them sell them a week later? You gotta wonder!

[Jim 2]

Spidey makes a convincing argument if you ask me.

 

Would still be interesting to see one of these in a Corrado tho :)

[John-M 0]

Still running mine after 2 1/2 years :)

[Yandards 0]

Looks like a nice torque plot above 2500rpm but pretty flat below that.

 

And flat after it aswell... torque falls 131nm from 2500 to 6700rpm, with a tiny flash of inspiration at 4000.

 

This is why I'm not a fan of the modern VAG diesels and petrol turbos. The fun is over almost as quickly as it arrived and with their torque strategy based mapping, the power delivery can be truly awful at times..... like our ME7.5 1.8T for example.....if for a moment the ECU suspects the wheels are going to spin, it cuts all turbo boost and closes the throttle, which if you're trying to join a motorway off a short slip road is fappin dangerous!

 

I do like the idea of a little 1.4 turbo in a corrado though. Small engine, high boost is looking like it's the way forward now because off boost economy can be diesel like......but...... is it what a Corrado is all about? Corrados to me are all about the 80s/90s sustained lunge to the red line. I'm 80s all the way. It's why I still have orange indicators and green interior lighting :D I don't think Corrados need these modern engines. Why do all Corrado owners who put 24Vs and 1.8Ts into them sell them a week later? You gotta wonder!

 

I get annoyed trying to find gauges that provide green lighting or head units, no-one seems to make them anymore. Although as neon and other 80s stuff appears to be back in then maybe green illumination will come back in too.

 

There is no character in modern engines thanks to mapping, most folks don't ever drive them hard so manufacturers code the ECU to produce peak power and torque below 5k; makes for a boring engine but if as that is what the masses want then the rest of us have to suffer.

 

I am very interested to see what can be had out of the twin charger set-up though, it has always had a level of appeal with me.

[Henny 0]

Kev? This'd be the first non-corrado engine this car'd have had... I want to modernise the engine and running gear a little to make more use of the newer technology and the G60s are, IMHO, becoming a little long in the tooth... I love the Corrado to bits (you may have noticed! :lol: ) but I just feel it needs something a little newer under the bonnet, and I'm not a big fan of the 1.8 20VT or the 2.0TFSI engine... and she's not a V6, so that only leaves a few other alternative power sources, the 170bhp 1.4 twincharged being one that should satisfy a lot of what I want out of a car... and trust me, if I don't like it when I've done it, I'll sell the engine and stick something else in it, not sell the car! ;) Oh, and she's not got (and won't be getting!) ABS or traction control, so no fear of the ECU sh!tting itself and pulling back on the power... ;) :norty:

 

mattnorgrove, ever had a look at a gasket and then placed it over the item it's going to seal up? notice that you can see metal through the gasket? The gaskets are produced to the blueprint specifications of the engine design, the metal castings have a large tolerance around that size so tend to have smaller oil, water and air ways going through them than the actual engine design allows for... Blue-printing an engine basically means making sure that all of the castings are to the exact spec of the design... it's sometimes known as gasket-matching too as, in effect, what you're doing is making sure that the holes in the gaskets line up perfectly either side with the things they're sealing... It should make for an engine which runs cooler, more efficiently and more powerfully than the standard, mass-produced item would do due to their large differences in castings... B)

 

I'm yet to find one of these engines, but I'm now on the lookout... I can feel a test-drive of a new one coming up on the cards shortly though, just to see what they're like in their natural standard habitat! :wink: :norty:

[mattnorgrove 0]

mattnorgrove, ever had a look at a gasket and then placed it over the item it's going to seal up? notice that you can see metal through the gasket? The gaskets are produced to the blueprint specifications of the engine design, the metal castings have a large tolerance around that size so tend to have smaller oil, water and air ways going through them than the actual engine design allows for... Blue-printing an engine basically means making sure that all of the castings are to the exact spec of the design... it's sometimes known as gasket-matching too as, in effect, what you're doing is making sure that the holes in the gaskets line up perfectly either side with the things they're sealing... It should make for an engine which runs cooler, more efficiently and more powerfully than the standard, mass-produced item would do due to their large differences in castings... B)

 

I see, so kind of "porting and polishing" then?

 

Had never heard the term, seems obvious now you've explained it though.

 

Ta for the info!

[JMC 0]

Personally I think this will be a great project Henny. Adding one of these engine to a nice light car and tweaking it as well should lead to a fun drive. Looking forward to see how it goes.

[Danny B 0]

Yeah I second the above, I think it will move the game on and is very in line with current smaller engine capacity trends - as this is clearly why you want to do it :D !!

 

Look forward to the thread if it happens :salute:

[Kevin Bacon 5]

John M - Yeah that's true. You're obviously more committed than some other people :wink:

 

Henny - Go for it dude, as Yan said, it will be interesting to see what that little 1400 is capable of, but if it were me I'd be putting a bigger turbo on it, LOL! :D Is it a turbo feeding the S/C system (compressed air getting compressed again) or is it some over engineered system where the S/C disenages itself at a set rpm / load etc? That's the only thing that bothers me with that engine, it's complexity, but I'm sure you'll suss it all out.

 

Looks like a nice torque plot above I get annoyed trying to find gauges that provide green lighting or head units, no-one seems to make them anymore. Although as neon and other 80s stuff appears to be back in then maybe green illumination will come back in too.

 

There is no character in modern engines thanks to mapping, most folks don't ever drive them hard so manufacturers code the ECU to produce peak power and torque below 5k; makes for a boring engine but if as that is what the masses want then the rest of us have to suffer.

 

I am very interested to see what can be had out of the twin charger set-up though, it has always had a level of appeal with me.

 

Yeah, tis why I like the old school "handbag" Alpines. They looked so at home in VWs, back in the day. I too hate all the blue and white facia lighting you get now, and dancing dolphins and things.

 

Yep, correct on the not driven hard thing. It's why they had to move the cat converters up to the exhaust manifolds, they just weren't getting up to temperature quick enough in their old locations under the car. Many of them run massively retarted timing during warm up now too, to get it up to temp really quickly. That's all the OEs care about - emissions. Like you say, if the shackles are removed, some of these engines should be capable of some good power and a good power band to go with it.

[mrbeige 0]

Liking your thinking Henny.

 

Are the 1.4TFSI engines GDI? If so, you will find it hard to replace the pistons with fancy light ones, as they will be designed to work with the injectors in the head. They would need to adhere to the original dome and bowl design to maintain proper combustion characteristics. I've done a bit of a search and couldn't find that many DI type forged pistons. Here's one :lol:

 

 

Rods, not a problem, nor lightening the crank etc. etc. but stick with the standard ECU if you can. It will need all the 'extra' stuff 'defeated' in the ECU so it doesnt throw a wobbler when 3/4 of the input signals it expects aren't there.

[weetos 0]

mmmm Go for it!

 

I too have been looking at putting this engine in my mk1 golf (just not too sure if i can justify the cost to my wife though!!)

 

watchin this space closely