Bio Fuel Petrol - warning from PH

[dalhalvaig 0]

Found this on PH this morning

 

worth a read

 

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=24900

[Jim Bowen 1]

Sounds abit of a nightmare.

 

Maybe we will all have to run brand new R32 lumps in the future.

[Supercharged 2]

Yeah, just read that too but already knew about as the Germans have been on about this for a while - E10 is evil stuff for older cars.

 

Supermarket Derv with Bio content is also very bad for PD engines

[bristolbaron 10]

Most of us will be using super anyway so won't be a problem - until prices go even crazier!

[Jim 2]

Yep.. two Scirocco owning friends of mine (Tempest from on here, and someone else) have been following the development and changes in legislation for fuels for a year or two now with increasing concern.

 

And apparently the fuel companies are not required by law or anything to divulge which of their fuels are biofuel mixed and to what percentage! Additionally, the German government at least has basically taken it upon them to force this stuff on the public despite overwhelming lack of interest. And essentially they don't care that this stuff ruins the engines in older cars - the main message being "tough luck, buy a new car".

 

Worrying times.

[davidwort 0]

My first reaction is similar to a couple of the responses on PH, storm in a teacup and not likely to affect our older petrol engines much, if at all.

PD diesels are a slightly different affair though as they have been designed to run on a very specific grade of fuel and oil, not like the old oil-burners that can literally run on used chip fat.

 

Actually, this reminds me a little of the old synthetic oil scares - 'don't use it in your old engine or it will destroy all the seals and leak out of places mineral oil can't, rubbish basically.

 

---------- Post added at 10:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:39 AM ----------

 

if you are really that worried:

http://www.frost.co.uk/ethomix-additive.html

Edited December 20, 2011 by davidwort

[mikkijayne 0]

Seems like a lot of hype tbh, given that according to the link in the PH article anything that can take unleaded is fine with E10 with the exception of some FSI / direct injection models. Interestingly the larger FSIs (V6 and V8 ) seem to be fine.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

None of my fleet of old cars are affected. Technically, no petrol engine should be if "BIO-ethanol" is used, which the text seems to imply is the case. It's only methanol that eats (unprotected) ally and some rubber seals.

 

Just more horseschitt to scare monger people into ditching their old cars for no good reason.

[Jim Bowen 1]

pistonhead features are written by morons, thats what i was told on another forum i use

[Supercharged 2]

pistonhead features are written by morons, thats what i was told on another forum i use

 

Yeah but that other forum was Corsasport... ;-)

[Tempest 0]

Just an update on the matter:

 

FUEL STABILITY ADDITIVE TEST RESULTS

Posted by admin on 13-04-2012

The FBHVC (Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs) is pleased to announce the results of its fuel stability additive test programme. This research was designed to test the anti-corrosive properties of proprietary additives claiming to provide a high level of protection against potential corrosion of fuel systems, including tanks, pipework and fuel metering equipment on historic vehicles caused by the addition of ethanol into petrol.

 

VSPe Power Plus, VSPe and EPS from Millers Oils; Ethomix from Frost A R T Ltd; Ethanolmate from Flexolite all received an ‘A’ rating in the research which enables all these products carry an endorsement from the FBHVC. The endorsement is in the form of the FBHVC logo and the words: ‘endorsed by the FBHVC as a fuel additive for protection against corrosion in metals’.

 

All additive manufacturers and suppliers were approached in 2011 to provide test samples for this research which was designed to simulate storage in a vehicle’s fuel tank for a 12 month period.

 

The FBHVC’s conference last October majored on the effects of ethanol in petrol with presentations from industry experts. It identified three issues to be considered: corrosion, compatibility and combustion. The Federation has been represented at a Fuel Stakeholders meetings with the DfT.

 

For details of the products please contact:

 

Millers’ Oils – email: [email protected]; website: http://www.millersoils.co.uk

 

Frost A R T Ltd – email: [email protected]; website: http://www.frost.co.uk

 

Flexolite – email: [email protected]; website: http://www.flexolite.co.uk

 

Just a reminder that about a year ago in Germany Mercedes have asked Bosch to check whether their K-Jets are safe, to which Bosch's answer was no. The corrosive properties of E10 are harmful to K-Jets as proven by Bosch.

 

It is true that there is no legislation in the UK forcing petrol stations to indicate the percentage ethanol in fuels unlike in Germany and France. Here in the UK, petrol stations have quietly been increasing the ethanol-percentage value by 1% each year. We're up to 5% as of 1/4/2012, in-line with normal 95-octane fuels on the continent.

 

Tempest

[dannyboy 0]

I've been using E10 petrol in my missis car which is an old punto, never had single problem. It think it just another OTT case of were 10% ethanol has caused a problem by causing fuel rubber lines to deteriorate faster than normal on older ,pre 90 cars. Normal petrol has up to 5% anyway so I think its just another case of people cause a storm in a tea-cup. I've used it quite a few times in my g60 and it ran better than normal 95. Over here E10 is 3-4 cent cheaper a litre for the off cost of lower calarific value of the ethanol than normal 95.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

The Corrado isn't even listed in the 'cars affected' list on that site.

[s1m0n 0]

Just more horseschitt to scare monger people into ditching their old cars for no good reason.

 

Agreed.

 

Some of the Subaru (and LOTS of the US street racing) community have been using 5-10% (or more) meth mixed with super for literally years. Straight Meth (basically alcohol) WILL degrade “natural” rubber and/or ally and/or unprotected parts but the points being made smack of sensationalism, tabloid journalism type stuff!

 

If (and that's IF) you ran into problems you'd just change out some parts...

 

Anyone wishing to educate themselves should check out some of the US street racing sites, lots of good info on the risks associated with running “funny fuel”.

 

Alternatively, stick with the sensationalist BS and run round bleating about “what if”....

 

Cheers for now

 

Simon

[Wild-Animal 0]

I know for the bio diesel it goes off after a period of time. Farmers were having a bit of a time when their go to their combine after a year and all of the fuel has congealed in the filters and the lines.

I believe red diesel has very little bio ness in it for that reason.