Bilstein B12 - from group buy. Rear springs

[edd 0]

Ok. So put my B12's on today. Had a quick run through some back roads and car feels nicely planted, a bit stiffer than I had expected if I'm honest and possibly more so on the rear but will give it some time. I am coming from the super soft late vr setup (small diameter top caps) too so it is a fair transition.

 

These are the ones I bought through the group buy on here (the one where Sean Jaymo had problems with the rear springs). I have an inkling that I too have faulty rear springs because the part numbers on mine rear springs reflect the faulty ones (the part numbers having changed on the ones that have been subsequently replaced by bilstein)

 

Because of this and due to the fact I had to get the larger diameter top caps on the front I used some lowering caps on the front to try and even out my predicted difference to the front and rear due to the (potentially) faulty Springs.

 

It was an absolute pig of a job as almost every bolt needed heat and considerable time having not been released in over 20 years. I had to pop to local garage to get front top strut nuts released with an impact wrench.

 

Regrettably I can't shift my doubts that I have the faulty rear springs. I had to cut 40mm+ off the rear bump stops as the rears were sat on them once the car was on the ground and the rear was much higher than front; really annoying as the shocks all had to come off and apart again after a long hot day in the sun already I was cursing. Rear dropped considerably more once they were shortened though.

 

Anyway photo of current stance, gap between top of wheel and arches seems to be slight less at back than front, but top of arch to ground seems to be fairly level all round. I'll let it settle and report back.

 

 

 

 

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[edd 0]

Next stop, brake disc splash guards front and rear. Not quite sure how mine aren't blowing away in the wind they are so rusted....

 

 

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[culshaw 1]

 

Here is how mine look from non-group buy. Personally i think the back is too low but waddayagannado

[Jim 2]

 

Here is how mine look from non-group buy. Personally i think the back is too low but waddayagannado

 

That would suggest you've got the wrong springs for the rear I think.. that definitely doesn't look right!

[edd 0]

Interesting. I was having a think and if bilstein won't help you it maybe possible to get a thicker ring made up that goes under the rear strut suspension coil base plate so that it moves the base plate upwards and creates more tension on the spring when sitting. Might not work but it is a theory you could probably test quite easy with a set of Spring clamps and a bit of time....

 

 

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[edd 0]

 

Here is how mine look from non-group buy. Personally i think the back is too low but waddayagannado

 

How long have had these in for Culshaw?

 

 

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[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

very odd goings on with these kits

 

odd fitment & there should never be a need to cut bump stops

[culshaw 1]

How long have had these in for Culshaw?

 

 

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about 400 miles. Annoyed I didn't make a note of the spring number now, but they were fitted after Will.i.dubs findings...

 

I've emailed Bilstein a few minute ago about them

[Dox 23]

There needs to be a sticky thread made with the info needed then a link forwarded to Bilstein to embarrass them into sorting their **** out, how hard can it be to update a database with the correct spring rates?

[edd 0]

Culshaw were your bumpstops cut? If so by how much?

 

 

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[culshaw 1]

need to check but i don't think they were

[edd 0]

As I mentioned mine was high at the rear with them left as standard. With the car sat on the ground level you could not move the bumpstops up or down at all on the damper strut as they were compressed between the top and bottom cups. I know they are said to be spring assisters but surely they should not impact the ride height.

 

I did quite a lot of online searches on this generally regarding b12 across various forums for differing cars and bilsteins advice over the telephone seemed to be

 

Customer: "should I cut bumpstops"

Bilstein: "you don't need to cut bumpstops",

customer: "but my car is sat high at the rear if I don't"

Bilstein: "ok you better cut them down then"

 

Really excelling themselves aren't they.....

 

 

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[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

As I mentioned mine was high at the rear with them left as standard. With the car sat on the ground level you could not move the bumpstops up or down at all on the damper strut as they were compressed between the top and bottom cups. I know they are said to be spring assisters but surely they should not impact the ride height.

 

I did quite a lot of online searches on this generally regarding b12 across various forums for differing cars and bilsteins advice over the telephone seemed to be

 

Customer: "should I cut bumpstops"

Bilstein: "you don't need to cut bumpstops",

customer: "but my car is sat high at the rear if I don't"

Bilstein: "ok you better cut them down then"

 

Really excelling themselves aren't they.....

 

 

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definitely not right from them

 

bump stops are there for a reason from factory - IE to stop the suspension bottoming out - & i am sure VW did some calculations about the size of them depending on weight/load/travel etc

 

i know from my experience with helping lower VW buses/campers that it is common for people to cut or remove bump stops so as to get the height they want, only to end up ruining the ride quality as the suspension cant travel properly & often results in steering issues too

 

as such if the rear bilstein's are not fitting right then they obviously are not correct for the car & its setup

 

i guess you will be asking them to buy you replacement bump stops as well Edd!!

[edd 0]

Prob is I bought the kit well over 12months ago so my only route for rectification is "not fit for purpose" as they are out of warranty...I going to wait and watch how mine settles for now as with the front lowering caps mine is pretty even all round...

 

 

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[g0ldf1ng3r 15]

Prob is I bought the kit well over 12months ago so my only route for rectification is "not fit for purpose" as they are out of warranty...I going to wait and watch how mine settles for now as with the front lowering caps mine is pretty even all round...

 

 

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as they are obviously incorrect for the car i would have thought warranties etc wouldnt matter as they were 'faulty' before you even took them out of the box

 

as such it shouldnt be a warranty claim as there were not right in the first place & then produced a fauly - ie a warranty situation - & as you say not fit for purpose

[seanl82 23]

I've just received my replacement springs direct from Eibach. The Bilstein customer service was atrocious at best, they just repeated themselves in quite an aggressive manner. I would have screamed at the guy if I thought it would help, but it was just denial throughout. I got onto Demon Tweeks who supplied me them, and bear in mind I only fitted mine around March I think, some 14 months after buying them. Demon tweeks customer service was exceptional and they really put the effort in to get this resolved for me. The reason for some being incorrect is apparently to do with the changeover ride height/springs and plate type on the VR6, so "some may not be correct". Initially though someone had a reply stating that it was an incorrect spring that was supplied by Eibach to them - which I'm more inclined to believe even though Bilstein have backtracked since then. I won't be changing the springs over for a couple of months at least, but I'll update on ride height and quality if someone else hasn't already done it by then.

Just to reiterate, go through whoever supplied the kit (the groupbuy was from a company the guy organising it used to work for), as they'll just fob off individuals.

[Bauhaus 3]

I don't think the Bilstein B12 kit issues are unique to the VR6, I have a 1991 corrado G60 and have the B12 kit No 46-190093, the rear spring Numbers on mine are 24-015530 and I had to cut the bumpstops to stop it looking like a crop sprayer, the front numbers are 35-003878 these seem ok.

I have had no real issues with the cut bumpstops just one incident with a speedbump at a local carpark with a passenger in the back, probably my fault for not slowing down enough :(

[edd 0]

This is how mine are sat now having been on for a week or so. I would say my rear springs are definitely from the batch that has had some issues for others.

 

By the looks of the photos mine are a similar drop at the rear to Culshaw's but because I've used front lowering caps the difference between front and rear is far less pronounced. Ironically I actually have the drop I was looking for (but not expecting) from the B12's but I'm not yet convinced on the comfort of the ride at the rear though and can't make up my mind if they are crashy at the rear or just harder than I'm used too...

 

Mk3highline who organised the group buy isn't getting back to me anymore unfortunately.

 

May have to fork out for an additional set of springs to get the correct rears, haven't decided yet. Will run them for a bit longer...

 

 

 

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Edited September 2, 2016 by edd

[edd 0]

As a rough guide I have 2 finger gap between top of arch and wheel at the front and 1 finger gap at rear with car sat on a flat surface. I have also cut 40mm off bumpstops. I.e. The bumpstops are not restricting the drop in any way

 

 

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[Jim 2]

The overall ride height looks OK there but the rear does look marginally lower still.. and the fact you used lowering caps on the front to get it to look even tells me that it's not right. That and having to cut the bump stops too. I'd be trying to get in touch with Bilstein to see about getting the correct springs sent.

[culshaw 1]

Ok so I think I may have got my wires crossed slightly, I had my socket set and a bike in the boot at the time of taking that picture WHOOPS!

 

So here's a pic with an empty boot bar the spare wheel (which is full size).

I can fit about three fingers at a squeeze inbetween top of wheel and arch for reference.

 

[gotvach 10]

I like that height. It looks decent and right for the car/wheels. What would you say is the overall drop from standard is there?

[dr_mat 0]

Ok well I vote "too low". :)

IMHO the wheel should sit centred in the wheel arch, as if the centre of the wheel was the centre of the rounding of the arch.

[culshaw 1]

i had a bit of a walk around the car yesterday and I have 4 fingers ok passenger side and 3 fingers on drivers side, with only fumes in the tank. I might have a word with the garage that fitted them

[Dox 23]

The correct way to measure ride height is from the centre of the wheel to the top of the arch, that way wheel size or tyre size has no influence on the result.