Definitive 24v into a (VR) Corrado thread

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

its far better then the 12v imo, I wouldn't want to swap back :)

the first drive you will notice straight away how it makes the car feel more alive, you slowly get used to it though.

the exhaust note is awesome! havent got board of that yet ;)

[J.C 10]

I fell in love with the VR6 when I drove my old man to the airport in his Golf VR6 in the early 90's, on my way home a numpty in a cavalier sri was tailgating me so I dropped it into 3rd and waved goodbye to him,

When we arrived from Australia(emigrated there in 1999) I bought a 97 golf vr6, such a sweet engine, the corrado's engine has always underwhelmed me, never as smooth, nor as nippy as the golf, when I drove the golf, I felt I was driving something special (engine) and that I could take on anyone, But the corrado is a special car but with an engine which has ordinary performance, I'm sure it's just my engine and with a bit of work it'll be back to being "special" but I have chosen to modernise with a 24v engine, and what with it going back to OZ with me next year, Air con is a must.

can't wait for it to be done

VWowner85, what exhaust are you running, I'm getting the magnex from the conversion as well, at least I know it all fits

Edited June 14, 2013 by J.C

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

I have a miltek catback with decat pipe, not to loud but it does liven up under full throttle ,

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

I have gotten abit further with my throttle pedal issue and I can safely say its 100% related to the vss wire I tapped in, as the pedal has been absolutely faultless with the vss wire I put in disconnected, iv been using the car almost everyday.

I cant find any solid reasons as to why the pedal plays up when this wire is connected up though, has anybody viewed the vehicle speed signal through measureing blocks on vcds? does it just say your current speed? , I asked the company that makes the mk4 ce2 plug n play harness about this and this doesn't seem like a common problem, although they did tell me that I can switch the ecu from manual transmission to auto transmission via vagcom and that removes the 5.5k vss fault!!! anybody know about this little trick? , one theory is when I connect the vss wire up , my ecu is then working as it should! and its detecting a fault with my pedal, I don't like that theory!! lol, although that is a cheap and easy fix if it is!

Edited June 18, 2013 by VW_OwneR_85

[taks 10]

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I have gotten abit further with my throttle pedal issue and I can safely say its 100% related to the vss wire I tapped in, as the pedal has been absolutely faultless with the vss wire I put in disconnected, iv been using the car almost everyday.

I cant find any solid reasons as to why the pedal plays up when this wire is connected up though, has anybody viewed the vehicle speed signal through measureing blocks on vcds? does it just say your current speed? , I asked the company that makes the mk4 ce2 plug n play harness about this and this doesn't seem like a common problem, although they did tell me that I can switch the ecu from manual transmission to auto transmission via vagcom and that removes the 5.5k vss fault!!! anybody know about this little trick? , one theory is when I connect the vss wire up , my ecu is then working as it should! and its detecting a fault with my pedal, I don't like that theory!! lol, although that is a cheap and easy fix if it is!

 

I got a three way splice going on...

Mine has the gearbox blue/white wire spliced into the mk4 loom (pin 54?) and then from there into the the ce2 loom for the clocks. I don't use w1. I don't have issues.

 

We have had throttle issues on 2 mk3 r32's

One turned out to be the throttle body. This car would go limp like you described, switch off and on- it was fine. We only determined what was going on by swapping the throttle body out.

The other was random revving by itself...this turned out to be the actual pedal that was faulty

Edited June 21, 2013 by taks
It all went a bit mental and done a double post in a post

[J.C 10]

I just bought a complete v6 4motion conversion and when I had a look at the supplied loom I saw a blue/white wire cut I questioned this and the reply was

"The blue/white wire in ecu plug is for vss I didn't run this as it stopped pedal from working,might have done it wrong? United motorsport can map that bit out "

Maybe it is not an uncommon problem..

[clumpy1 11]

Not totally sure mate but you may have a can of worm's there Kev haywire(bacon) is the man to ask there is one on ebay just now that was done by PSI i saw it on ebay the current owner bought it from ebay and in his advert on ebay now he say's he paid 2K but is willing tolet it go for 1K :scratch: issue's? got to do your homework regarding this stuff.I have been lucky with mine just hope you are as lucky mate.

'

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

[/color]

 

I got a three way splice going on...

Mine has the gearbox blue/white wire spliced into the mk4 loom (pin 54?) and then from there into the the ce2 loom for the clocks. I don't use w1. I don't have issues.

 

We have had throttle issues on 2 mk3 r32's

One turned out to be the throttle body. This car would go limp like you described, switch off and on- it was fine. We only determined what was going on by swapping the throttle body out.

 

thanks for your reply, which 24v have you got?, so you basically just cut into one of the three wires from the speed sensor of the gearbox? seeing as my car runs without fault {only 5.5k rev limit} without the vss wire hooked up that's telling me things like throttle body,pedal etc is working correctly? , if anything was at fault surely it would appear with the vss disconnected or connected ?, I think my next step would be to reconnect the vss wire back to W-1 {as my wires right there} and view the vss via vcds and see what it says there, thanks..

 

I just bought a complete v6 4motion conversion and when I had a look at the supplied loom I saw a blue/white wire cut I questioned this and the reply was

"The blue/white wire in ecu plug is for vss I didn't run this as it stopped pedal from working,might have done it wrong? United motorsport can map that bit out "

Maybe it is not an uncommon problem..

 

yea I posted up in my thread awhile ago explaining that I was connecting up the vss and the guy who you brought your loom from {20vtvw} did the same as me, although it stopped his pedal dead! but it didn't stop mine dead, at the time I could drive my car for a straight 40min drive with it working fine the whole journey which is why I didn't notice any faults after I connected that wire up, I didn't think it was related to the vss wire I put in, but then I realised the pedal will only act up if I stop off some where mid journey with like a 20-30min stop off, after that the pedals intermittent as buggery!,

the reason im thinking this is rare/un heard of, is because everyone else that does this sort of conversion uses the help of tuning companys after its installed and has a remap, if mine had a remap to raise the rev limit I wouldn't have throttle issues as I wouldn't need the vss signal which is killing my pedal, I have the BDE 2.8 and im pretty sure 20vtvw's is AUE ? so these two models have throttle issues when vss is connected to w-1 , we know that much! ,

Edited June 21, 2013 by VW_OwneR_85

[J.C 10]

Being an electrical Engineer, Issues are what I like:thumbleft:

once I get the car back from the garage, I plan to give it workthrough, neatening the wiring, hopefully getting the MPG reading to work etc

I wont embarress myself by commenting on the VSS problem just yet, as I'm not up to speed on the 24V conversion

[Sean_Jaymo 0]

I think many people have tried to fix the mpg problem and as far as I know, nobody has got it to work yet.

 

I'll be hugely impressed if you can make it work :-) I don't think anyone else has been an electrical engineer tho!

[dil 0]

thanks for your reply, which 24v have you got?, so you basically just cut into one of the three wires from the speed sensor of the gearbox? seeing as my car runs without fault {only 5.5k rev limit} without the vss wire hooked up that's telling me things like throttle body,pedal etc is working correctly? , if anything was at fault surely it would appear with the vss disconnected or connected ?, I think my next step would be to reconnect the vss wire back to W-1 {as my wires right there} and view the vss via vcds and see what it says there, thanks..

 

Taks has a Mk4 R32 in his engine bay same as mine, I had the VSS issue in that it would be fine to drive for some time and then due to the lack of Speed signal (VSS) the ECU would slap a hard limit of 5.5K, if i understood VSS correctly, the VSS signal came from G'Box to Fuse Book, upto clocks back from clocks and out on w1 to the ECU, I found out i didnt have the w1 feed back to the ECU, can remeber the Pin, once i connected that up all was good.

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

Taks has a Mk4 R32 in his engine bay same as mine, I had the VSS issue in that it would be fine to drive for some time and then due to the lack of Speed signal (VSS) the ECU would slap a hard limit of 5.5K, if i understood VSS correctly, the VSS signal came from G'Box to Fuse Book, upto clocks back from clocks and out on w1 to the ECU, I found out i didnt have the w1 feed back to the ECU, can remeber the Pin, once i connected that up all was good.

 

Yea that's how I understand the vss to be aswell,so on early mk2 golfs that w-1 wont actually be there as the early clocks don't have a vss feed for it, also on the original vr6 engine harness you have the blue/white wire for the vss to ecu on w-1 on a single plug, thing is when my 24v vss is hooked up to w-1 it sorts out the rev limit, so it works as it should its just in return it gives my throttle pedal an intermittent fault after a stop off anywhere mid journey so its almost like a temperature related fault? as its fine if started from cold, without the vss hooked up I can drive it 24/7 happy as larry with just the 5.5k rev limit, seeing as another forum member also had this on his AUE im starting to think that on some 24v models that it expects a different kind of vss signal? not sure , ill view the vss signal on vcds measuring blocks and see what it says in relation to my actual vehicle speed :)

 

im wandering if relay 109 could be to blame? iv since renewed it for the newer updated version so I might have to reconnect the vss lol I think ill put it on a switch haha saves me snipping it everytime cheers..

[taks 10]

Hmm.....

 

Good idea about the checking the vehicle speed using vcds, I had planned the same as a sanity check on wednesday before attaching my driveshafts.

 

Mine has been wired slightly differently to the proper way dil has detailed for you. Mine is going from the gearbox to the ecu wiring and tailing on this join to the clocks (negating the need to use w1)

 

One of us will report back on the exact impact of this if any after Weds, but on out initial testing it hasn't shown any faults

 

I know for sure w1 is not a bridged port for the vss into the fuse board, so my assumption would be that w1 is fed from an output of the clocks - could your clocks be causing you issues? (thinking out loud?)

Edited June 24, 2013 by taks

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

"so my assumption would be that w1 is fed from an output of the clocks" - could your clocks be causing you issues? "

 

 

yea I belive your assumption to be right, not sure with my clocks though, only evidence I have to know that they are working ok is the old 12v vr6 was fine in that department, also thinking about that relay 109 , I think I can rule that out because if it was relay related stuff would of happened regardless of me connecting up the vss, cheers for your time...

 

edit just noticed -

 

"One of us will report back on the exact impact of this if any after Weds, but on out initial testing it hasn't shown any faults"

 

ok cool , would appreciate that, on initial testing of my vss everything was fine , idle'd and drove beautifully, like I mentioned in my posts above I needed to stop off some where mid journey for 20-30mins and only then does the pedal act up, I could straight drive the car fine {max time of about 40mins straight no engine off stops, this fault never appeared on a straight drive}, at first I thought it wasn't related to the vss as it was some time after I had made that connection but then I realised it only happens if I stop off somewhere for a period of time, hasn't happened since cutting vss wire I put in..

Edited June 25, 2013 by VW_OwneR_85

[taks 10]

"so my assumption would be that w1 is fed from an output of the clocks" - could your clocks be causing you issues? "

 

 

yea I belive your assumption to be right, not sure with my clocks though, only evidence I have to know that they are working ok is the old 12v vr6 was fine in that department, also thinking about that relay 109 , I think I can rule that out because if it was relay related stuff would of happened regardless of me connecting up the vss, cheers for your time...

 

Can you do as me and go straight from the gearbox to the ecu, and share that join, then to go back to the fusebox for the clocks?

You will bypass the troubleshooting of w1, the clocks and fuseboard in regards to vss.....

Although if you wait until after weds I can tell you if this is a good idea or not :-)

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

cheers taks and dil, today the throttle started playing up without the vss connected!! its the first time its done it, so im seeing this as a good thing , atleast we can now throw the vss out the window and start again, although its strange how 20vtvws throttle went dead after connecting his vss, im going to scan the ecu either tonight or tomo and hopefully there be something to work off, im guessing it will go like this > replace pedal-or trace throttle wires back to ecu and see if anything was bodged/misplaced. thanks....

[J.C 10]

cheers taks and dil, today the throttle started playing up without the vss connected!! its the first time its done it, so im seeing this as a good thing , atleast we can now throw the vss out the window and start again, although its strange how 20vtvws throttle went dead after connecting his vss, im going to scan the ecu either tonight or tomo and hopefully there be something to work off, im guessing it will go like this > replace pedal-or trace throttle wires back to ecu and see if anything was bodged/misplaced. thanks....

 

I've got 20VTVWS engine and my throttle WOULDN'T work unless VSS was connected,

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

I've got 20VTVWS engine and my throttle WOULDN'T work unless VSS was connected,

 

it was the other way around bud , his throttle wouldn't work with the vss connected { to w-1}

 

I just double checked with my inbox messages to confirm, heres one of the messages from 20vtvw

 

"Hi I'm good thanks,,when I connected that wire I lost the pedal completely,,I spoke to united Motorsport and they said that as part of there re map they raise the rev limiter to get around the vss problem,I was going to do it that way "

[dil 0]

when you have the accelerator issue, does the car spaz out , and its almost as if its misfiring rapidly? the accelerator becomes inoperable?

[J.C 10]

it was the other way around bud , his throttle wouldn't work with the vss connected { to w-1}

 

I just double checked with my inbox messages to confirm, heres one of the messages from 20vtvw

 

"Hi I'm good thanks,,when I connected that wire I lost the pedal completely,,I spoke to united Motorsport and they said that as part of there re map they raise the rev limiter to get around the vss problem,I was going to do it that way "

not when I put it in my car, the pedal didn't work until I reconnected the blue/white wire which 20vtvw had cut

saying that, I'm still in the install stage(no road use yet)

 

---------- Post added at 4:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 4:40 PM ----------

 

it was the other way around bud , his throttle wouldn't work with the vss connected { to w-1}

 

I just double checked with my inbox messages to confirm, heres one of the messages from 20vtvw

 

"Hi I'm good thanks,,when I connected that wire I lost the pedal completely,,I spoke to united Motorsport and they said that as part of there re map they raise the rev limiter to get around the vss problem,I was going to do it that way "

not when I put it in my car, the pedal didn't work until I reconnected the blue/white wire which 20vtvw had cut

saying that, I'm still in the install stage(no road use yet)

[VW_OwneR_85 2]

 

16885 -P0501 = Vehicle Speed Sensor Range/Performance.,

 

although when the vss was connected up and the pedal died the 2 fault codes logged then were 18047= pedal pos sensor 1+2 range/performance

16990= ecm/pcm processor

 

im going to stop clogging up the 24v thread now ;) , any admins feel free to delete my vss saga ,unless you think it may help others,

 

ok I think I know what I have done!! im just looking at the wiring diagrams for the throttle pedal that go to the ecu plug , one of the 6 pedal wires is coloured WHITE AND BLUE! the same as the vss wire!! I did triple check that it was pin54 when I snipped the vss wire but you know stranger and stupider mistakes have been made! before, im really hopeing that's the problem!!!

Edited June 25, 2013 by VW_OwneR_85

[taks 10]

Congrats mate.

I think you nailed it

 

---------- Post added at 1:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 1:48 PM ----------

 

Congrats mate.

I think you nailed it

[Kevin Bacon 5]

No it's staying, all useful info!

[taks 10]

I will report back tonight to see if you can get away with splicing the gearbox wire straight to the ecu (pin54) and the off to the clock (invariably all on the same line)

Before I go:

 

Using VCDS where to I go to see the vehicle speed not engine speed?

How do I check timing as I did the chains?

How do I check the accelerator pedal position? (I think it is block 50 something but can't find a definitive answer)

 

Thanks

 

Also for info:

 

Other useful checks before I have put the front end on is:

Clutch switch operation: Block 66

Brake switch operation: Block 66

Timing chain stretch: 208 and 209

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Measuring blocks 208 and 209 for the cam timing. Should be in the range -3 and -1 but the allowable tolerance is +/- 8 deg.

 

For the other bits, when you open the Measuring blocks page in VCDS, there is a label file in the top corner that you click. Normally called something like 021 906 032 CP.txt. If you click this, a box opens up with a list of all the Measuring blocks and what they translate to.

 

If you have 'file not found' instead, we need to do some manual tweaking, but if you're using a BUB or BDB engine, it'll be there. BFH (MK4) is missing as it's only available in German, but there's a way round, which I had to do for my BFH motor.