simon_miles 0 Posted July 16, 2009 Hi Chaps Just got a standard VR6 what the best and / or cheapest way to up the BHP? :scratch: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrbeige 0 Posted July 16, 2009 There isn't a particularly easy/cheap way to do it to be fair. Apart from the obvious, exhaust, exhuast manifold, indution kit which don't have a huge effect. A few people have had good results with the Schimmel 263 cams and a remap, but you wont get change out of £600-700, even if you fit the cams yourself. Supercharging seems to be the preferred method of substantially upping BHP. Kits are available, and there are a few different manufacturers to choose from - Rotrex/Vortech/Z-Engineering, but you are looking at a minimum of £1800ish for that kit, but for a DIYer, it is possible to fit yourself. Next up is turbo, but the ways to do that are almost limitless, and you'll also need a fairly large wallet for that :D Have a look through the members gallery on here for inspiration of what is possible and in most cases, you can get a general idea of cost from them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VR6 0 Posted July 16, 2009 As with most of your questions, the search (and a quick read about how it works best), is your best bet. Standard VR gains = minor or expensive. Induction kit/air filter De-cat Exhaust Cams Schrick manifold Supercharger Turbo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay2 0 Posted July 17, 2009 Cheapest way of extra Bhp is swap your VR6 for a G60. :grin: .........I'll get my coat.............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
psiburr 0 Posted July 17, 2009 Cheapest way of extra Bhp is swap your VR6 for a G60. :grin: .........I'll get my coat.............. ahmen to that brudder !! my 1.9 stage 5 charged, stage 4 chipped G60 is not just a daily runner but a daily "oh my god I'm going to die'er"..... in a good way :D as william wallis once said : VR6's You make take our litreage but you'll never take our low down torque !!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim 1 Posted July 17, 2009 VR6's You make take our litreage but you'll never take our low down torque !!!!!! Turbo a VR and the goalposts change somewhat - power comes in MUCH sooner. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
millerman 0 Posted July 17, 2009 ooohhhhh can see this becoming a battle of the blowers :D :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neil VR6 0 Posted July 17, 2009 NA tuning is a mug's game IMO unless you've got big money. I'd save and go FI if you're really serious. Or buy a faster car Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henny 0 Posted July 17, 2009 VR6's You make take our litreage but you'll never take our low down torque !!!!!! Turbo a VR and the goalposts change somewhat - power comes in MUCH sooner. yeah, but turbo a G60 and you can get silly power much, much, much cheaper than turbo-ing a VR6... ;) It's all relative to cost isn't it... :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted July 17, 2009 as william wallis once said : VR6's You make take our litreage but you'll never take our low down torque !!!!!! Who the frig is William Wallis?! :lol: A standard VR makes more power and torque than a G60, but it just doesn't 'feel' like it does. Ditto with the age old 16V v 8V debate. I've driven a few G60s which feel utterly, utterly gutless everywhere in the rev range and they NEED the smaller pulley and remap just feel remotely interesting. Likewise, I've driven standard VR6s that couldn't pull a duvet off a bed. And they also need a turbo to make them feel interesting. In short, all VW engines are schitt unless modified :lol: ooohhhhh can see this becoming a battle of the blowers :D :D There is no battle. A blown VR trounces everything, end of :lol: Henny mentions cost, but come on, 400hp from a VRT is cheap. 400hp from any 4 pot VAG engine costs a fortune. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The_Dude 0 Posted July 17, 2009 as william wallis once said : VR6's You make take our litreage but you'll never take our low down torque !!!!!! Who the frig is William Wallis?! :lol: aka Mel Gibson. :D Freeeeedoooommmmmm! Low down torque my arse, just change down a gear! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leonard 0 Posted July 17, 2009 Spend money on the handling, LSD and brakes first! Everything Im kinda not doing :grin: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted July 17, 2009 Indeed, do more with what you've got than add a tonne of power and swiftly spin off the road! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bananawhip 0 Posted July 17, 2009 NA tuning is a mug's game IMO unless you've got big money. I'd save and go FI if you're really serious. Or buy a faster car No disrespect and appreciate you put an IMO in your post but I'd say it's that kind of attitude that put's the UK so far behind the US in terms of tuning, stuff like picking up a spanner and fettling a 60's Chevy into a 1000bhp at the wheels all motor weapon. We seem transfixed on slapping FI on everything and paying through the nose for countless remaps. Although the yanks build crap from the factory they have an overwhelming understanding of aftermarket tuning with even the most novice grease monkey making big figures from NA. Don't get me wrong a supercharger is on my to-do list but I have the most respect for NA tuning as it's a fading art form. My Schimmels cost me £200 when the pound was strong, didn't bother with tappets as I have a very low milage block, fitted them myself over a few evenings and a crate of beer, absolutely transformed the car and I'd very much doubt they gave any less then 20bhp and that's without a map. Saying that IMO the first mod on every VR should be 288mm brakes before you start upping the power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dirtytorque 0 Posted July 17, 2009 NA tuning is a mug's game IMO unless you've got big money. I'd save and go FI if you're really serious. Or buy a faster car No disrespect and appreciate you put an IMO in your post but I'd say it's that kind of attitude that put's the UK so far behind the US in terms of tuning, stuff like picking up a spanner and fettling a 60's Chevy into a 1000bhp at the wheels all motor weapon. We seem transfixed on slapping FI on everything and paying through the nose for countless remaps. Although the yanks build crap from the factory they have an overwhelming understanding of aftermarket tuning with even the most novice grease monkey making big figures from NA. Don't get me wrong a supercharger is on my to-do list but I have the most respect for NA tuning as it's a fading art form. My Schimmels cost me £200 when the pound was strong, didn't bother with tappets as I have a very low milage block, fitted them myself over a few evenings and a crate of beer, absolutely transformed the car and I'd very much doubt they gave any less then 20bhp and that's without a map. Saying that IMO the first mod on every VR should be 288mm brakes before you start upping the power. I hear what your saying but blowing a car designed to be n/a isn't easy either.Not if your going to do it properly and reliably.There is a fair bit of skill involved in both disciplines. And there certain area's of tuning the crossover between n/a tuning and FI tuning anyway. This forum is very biased towards FI tuning i agree but I think it is to do with bang for buck. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrbeige 0 Posted July 17, 2009 This forum is very biased towards FI tuning i agree but I think it is to do with bang for buck. Normally something goes bang and it costs bucks.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dirtytorque 0 Posted July 17, 2009 This forum is very biased towards FI tuning i agree but I think it is to do with bang for buck. Normally something goes bang and it costs bucks.... yeah who doesn't like fire works?!! :wink: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted July 17, 2009 No disrespect and appreciate you put an IMO in your post but I'd say it's that kind of attitude that put's the UK so far behind the US in terms of tuning, stuff like picking up a spanner and fettling a 60's Chevy into a 1000bhp at the wheels all motor weapon. We seem transfixed on slapping FI on everything and paying through the nose for countless remaps. Although the yanks build crap from the factory they have an overwhelming understanding of aftermarket tuning with even the most novice grease monkey making big figures from NA. Don't get me wrong a supercharger is on my to-do list but I have the most respect for NA tuning as it's a fading art form. I have to agree with your sentiments. Different situaton in the US of A though. Americans have access to huge resources compared to us and massively cheaper fuel. You can walk into a Walmart, buy your week's groceries, half a dozen new outfits, a roller cab full of tools, a welding station, and Edelbrock carbs and heads for a chevy small block, all from the same store :D ! You can also ring up Jegs, FourSeasons, Summit Racing etc and get a brand new V8 crate engine delivered to your door for the same price as rebuilding a VR6 lump over here. God bless America :notworthy: Compare that to the UK. We have to pay £600 for Schrick cams, £1500 for a VGI intake, £150 for a bigger throttle and another £350 to map it all up. And the end result is a rather poor +20-30hp. Poor value if you ask me! The yanks can get 1000hp out a of V8 because they have 1000s of parts available to do it, not to mention the cubic capacity to begin with. More and more yanks are turning to turbos now though. Like it or not, small capacity turbo engines are the future. Best we can get out of a VR6 NA is ~ 250hp. It's just a crap engine for NA tuning. Sorry, but it is. You need the 24V for that. That engine is definitely capable of 100hp / litre NA, reliably. The 12V isn't! The heads just don't flow. So that's why we just don't bother with NA tuning on the VR. it's too expensive for the small gains you get in return. Turbos are now excellent and no longer have lag that can be measured with a sun dial. You can build a turbo VR to behave NA or like a turbo motor, it's your choice, plenty of parts (from America, LOL!) to do it! Saying that IMO the first mod on every VR should be 288mm brakes before you start upping the power. Agreed! The stock VR6 brakes are absolutely pathetic, but then there are people who think they're good! :cuckoo: Horses for courses :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bananawhip 0 Posted July 17, 2009 Point taken, they definitely have it good across the pond A good friend of mine is Californian and had his Buick Grand National shipped over a little while back (FI I know but that's not the point) He would work on his the same time I'd work on mine but the difference in parts and options would be vast! To the point he could quite easily build the car from the ground up again with new parts shipped over if he wanted and his was a 1987 limited production car. Just the magazines he had sent across made me genuinely embarrassed to be British and associated with the (majority) utterly crap tuning mags we have over here. I know small capacity FI is the way we're heading but if we so readily accept in the UK, it makes it even easier for VW to get away with giving us mundane cars like the R20 Scirocco when we all know it sould be a R36 :) Rant over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Bacon 5 Posted July 17, 2009 Defo agree there. The yanks are being forced into Small capacity aswell because of this global warming fiasco. What annoys me is VW are binning the R32, but keeping the R36 (and bigger) for the exec saloons etc. I'm sorry, but if the rest of us have to lose out on a good engine, why should the big cars still be allowed a big engine? The answer to that is - to ferry around the CO2 law making Brussels arseholes in luxury. Makes me mad :censored: It's not all bad though because the 2.0 TFSI engine can make 325hp with a remap, bigger fuel pump and some intake changes, as demonstrated by the Scirocco GT24! The only bad thing is it will be a dull sounding 325hp! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bananawhip 0 Posted July 17, 2009 A dull sounding car is not unfortunately my cup of tea, that sort of tuning though is I suppose something to look forward to. I'm going to go on Dragons Den with a business plan...I'm going to steal anything R36, take the engine out, set fire to the car and any evidence, then sell the block for pittance to anyone with a car weighing less then 1400kg, won't have many business overheads and I'll be like Robin Hood :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The_Dude 0 Posted July 17, 2009 A dull sounding car is not unfortunately my cup of tea, that sort of tuning though is I suppose something to look forward to. I'm going to go on Dragons Den with a business plan...I'm going to steal anything R36, take the engine out, set fire to the car and any evidence, then sell the block for pittance to anyone with a car weighing less then 1400kg, won't have many business overheads and I'll be like Robin Hood :) so what would you need the cash for? holidays? :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
psiburr 0 Posted July 17, 2009 **Silly question alert ** Buuutttt I've just had my G60 de-catted and fitted with a larger bore pipe (still got 2 boxes on it) it could be my imagination but it feels like I've lost some power :( any thoughts ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bananawhip 0 Posted July 17, 2009 so what would you need the cash for? holidays? Good point, petrol, gloves, and an engine crane just to get me going..call it £400 for 10% of the company, you interested? :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VRTrickster 0 Posted July 18, 2009 Just out of interest bananawhip, whats the spec of your engine? Youve got some good numbers there mate! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
