Are my expectations too high for KW v1's and 17inch wheels with skinny tyres?

[mookie 0]

Essentially, I'm somewhat bemused by the terrible ride quality my Corrado has. The initial novelty factor of it all has now completely worn off, to be replaced by skepticism as to whether or not there is something wrong, or I just have an awful combination of ride height/wheels/tyres.

 

Here's a side on pic of my car for reference

 

 

And the specs:

 

KW v1's Inox (fairly new so unlikely to be worn out or leaking, no signs anyway...)

17inch TT Comps

195/40 tyres

OEM suspension bushes etc (as far as I can see and am aware)

 

The issue is how bumpy and uncomfortable the ride is. Is this solely down to the skinny tyres, or are people running similar setups and finding it comfortable on KWs?

 

I'm a well experienced fellow when it comes to lowered suspension. I've had Mk2 Golfs on everything from lowering springs (crashy), to eBay special coilovers (bouncy and bumpy), to FK Sport Edition Plus coilovers (smooth, firm, but very comfortable). And pretty low at that on fairly skinny tyres. I'm realistic about what to expect and have my fair share of grounded out and sump whacking, teeth jarring, and what not.

 

But the Corrado rides like the Golf did on the super cheap (read: rock hard) coilovers. There is a lot of thread left on the coilovers so they're not even wound down that low (no intention of going lower I might add...), nothing on the car catches except the occasion brush of the splitter on very steep speedbumps (no sump or underside of the car rubbing or scrapping what so ever). But driving on anything other than the motorway or new tarmac is a total pain in the neck. Crossing the thick yellow painted 'slow down' lines coming up to a round about is like going over a cattle grid on a skateboard :bonk:

 

Is this the same kind of experience other owners have on KW's with 17s? I honestly expected a much better ride than this, not OEM comfort but on a par with the sort of thing my old FKs offered (although admittedly they were adjustable damping) considering the KWs are actually more expensive even in non-Inox form. I like how Corrado's look on 17s, and I like a car to sit nice without lots of arch gap (sorry OEM fans) but at this rate I can see myself going 16 with fatter tyres... or would an extra 5mm on the profile of the tyres to 45 from 40, make enough difference?

[j_s14a 0]

Are the tyres stretched? If so, just putting on some correct width tyres would certainly help.

[VR6 0]

17's look good for sure but I think they are just one inch too much in terms of comfort. They say the same about me though :norty:

[Jim Bowen 1]

I run the same coilovers and standard wheels and tyres and do find the ride quite firm on rough roads.

 

I have my suspension set quite high and find the springs don't have much travel in them like that. Almost looks like going lower would give me more spring travel, I might try it next time round.

 

Other than that I just go a bit slower on bumpy roads and try to enjoy the corners instead.

 

Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk 2

[mookie 0]

Are the tyres stretched? If so, just putting on some correct width tyres would certainly help.

 

Not much stretch at all tbh, certainly a lot less than I've run on 15s with a nice ride quality.

 

17's look good for sure but I think they are just one inch too much in terms of comfort. They say the same about me though :norty:

 

Yeah kind of what I feared. Problem is scaling up the tyre size means you then undermine how good they look. And too much information there at the end...

 

I run the same coilovers and standard wheels and tyres and do find the ride quite firm on rough roads.

 

I have my suspension set quite high and find the springs don't have much travel in them like that. Almost looks like going lower would give me more spring travel, I might try it next time round.

 

Other than that I just go a bit slower on bumpy roads and try to enjoy the corners instead.

 

Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk 2

 

I really trundle at low speed limits mate, which is funnily enough where I notice the bumps and rattles. High speed, motorway driving is silky smooth and feels like different suspension. But I guess the motorway tends to be much better maintained and smoother surface. Annoying how badly maintained the roads are in parts of the North East. Just a massive patchwork quilt of repairs in some cases. I do agree about the travel in the coilovers, there is some, it's not rock hard or anything. But on the second softest setting of my FKs, it was almost OEM like in terms of rebound. Although it's hard to compare the two different cars/engine weights etc...

[j_s14a 0]

Not much stretch at all tbh, certainly a lot less than I've run on 15s with a nice ride quality.

 

But a combination of lower profile tyres on 17s compared to 15s, and stretch (which ruins the tyres natural suspension) will have a pretty terrible effect.

[Harrier 1]

I have KW V1s with 205x 40x17s & the ride is pretty firm but not excessively so.Having said that i dont use the car as a daily drive,i think it would become tiresome if i did.Your ride height looks about the same as mine but the tyre profile looks very low with 195/40,that could make a difference.

[fla 9]

Tyres can affect ride quality very significantly. I have Toyos (rear) and Westlakes (front) on mine and the ride is quite comfortable. Had some budget ones on the other 17s and it was just too hard.

[vornwend 0]

I have KW V1s with 205x 40x17s & the ride is pretty firm but not excessively so.Having said that i dont use the car as a daily drive,i think it would become tiresome if i did.Your ride height looks about the same as mine but the tyre profile looks very low with 195/40,that could make a difference.

 

I'm have exactly the same as Harrier and don't have any issues with ride quality. I also don't use it as a daily but would not have a problem with doing so - some feedback from the road makes for a more engaging driving experience but I can understand not everybody feels like that - my missus won't go near the car!

[mookie 0]

It's more than just feedback, it's bumpy as hell. And not in a potentially good way either.

 

So judging from comments from KW owners, the coilovers aren't the culprit here? Tyre wise my only option I think is either the same profile but 205s... which doesn't seem a good plan. Or 195/45s. Can't seem to find a 195/50 in 17inches for some reason?

[Abdul 0]

Ok, I had 195/40's on my 17" azev a's and my storm had fk konigsports which provide a more comfortable ride all day long in comparison to the kw v1's (yes I've had both) but the car still rode like sh*t. Honestly rubber band tyres ruin the entire drive and the fact that the wheels are 17's doesnt help.

 

205/40's are more compliant and about as big as you'd want to go tyre wise but ultimately 16's offer the best compromise.

 

Btw 205/40's will have a skinnier side wall then a 195/45 iirc. I had 205/40 yoko parada spec2's on 17x7.5's at one point and the tyre just looked like a normal low profile-ish tyre with a very square side wall. Rode nice IMO.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Abdul

[KADVR6 0]

whats the part number on the KW's, maybe they are not vr6 specific as i'm running V1's with 205/40/17 and my car is ok at low/high speed.

[mookie 0]

No they defo are the right model:

 

http://kwshop.co.uk/index.php?sort=_&page_id=product_single_view&product_id=17732&mg=26&pg=160

[KADVR6 0]

can you borrow a set of 15's or 16's and see what its like then, and did the collar arrive today??

[mookie 0]

Oh poop yes it did! Thanks mate! Just need another one now...

 

Yeah I'm going to see if I can rustle something up to try.

 

People running 17s, what tyres are you running?

[j_s14a 0]

It's more than just feedback, it's bumpy as hell. And not in a potentially good way either.

 

So judging from comments from KW owners, the coilovers aren't the culprit here? Tyre wise my only option I think is either the same profile but 205s... which doesn't seem a good plan. Or 195/45s. Can't seem to find a 195/50 in 17inches for some reason?

 

 

You'll struggle to get a 50 profile in 17s, the rolling radius is enormous (on most cars, as the tyres aren't stretched)

[P3rks 11]

 

People running 17s, what tyres are you running?

 

195/40/17 on a 7.5 up front.

205/40/17 on a 8.5 rear.

 

It's not a nice ride per say - You feel everything on the road. But it's not crashy or loud one bit. On smooth roads such as Newcastles finest; it's spot on.

 

I'm running Weitecs so the cheap version of your Coilovers.

 

I ran 195/50/16 before and the ride was very smooth and comfortable.

 

Maybe as what's already been said, try and find some smaller wheels with a larger tyre profile to try?

[Kevin Bacon 5]

4 things wrong here:-

 

1 - The ride height. It's way too low. The amount of threads left on the damper bodies isn't relevant, it's vehicle height that's important and yours won't give you much suspension travel at all.

 

2 - 195/40s + heavy wheels.

 

3 - KW V1s. They are too hard (imo) even with 205/50/15s.

 

4 - Your expecations that you can get good ride quality from a Corrado :D Even as standard they are far from smooth and comfortable!

 

The only way I could get mine to have a good handling / ride compromise was to use KW's softer spring option and turn the damping up. And also going no lower than a 2 finger gap (between arch and tyre).

 

If you want 17s, make sure they are as light as possible, stick to 205/40 and use Continental rubber. You will be a lot happier with that, I promise.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

17's look good for sure but I think they are just one inch too much in terms of comfort. They say the same about me though :norty:

 

'They' of course being the leather clad sailors down at your local gay bar, and the extra inch they don't like is naturally your waist line....

[DriverVR6 11]

Sensible post and good advice by FishWick.

 

I just don't get the really low, huge wheel and rock hard suspension approach. If it is uncomfortable and doesn't handle any better (infact it will be alot worse with appalling cornering and less efficient braking) then why do it?

 

The only cars that have next to zero suspension travel are F1 cars, and I don't remember seeing one of them driving around on the road?? Also, even F1 cars have large tyres to provide a degree of compliance and "give" in their setup.

Edited June 12, 2012 by DriverVR6

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Because people who want 'handling' are in the minority. I.e. to take VW's goodwork and take it to the next level with minimal compromise.

 

It would appear it's mostly about earning scene points these days, and boasting how many sumps the low riders can destroy in a week!

 

I think the tyres on F1 cars are the only suspension compliance! If you look at slo mos of the tyre / suspension behaviour over the kerbs, it's only the tyre that really gives, and even then it's minimal.

[Abdul 0]

Sensible post and good advice by FishWick.

 

I just don't get the really low, huge wheel and rock hard suspension approach. If it is uncomfortable and doesn't handle any better (infact it will be alot worse with appalling cornering and less efficient braking) then why do it?

 

The only cars that have next to zero suspension travel are F1 cars, and I don't remember seeing one of them driving around on the road?? Also, even F1 cars have large tyres to provide a degree of compliance and "give" in their setup.

 

I used to love this look and think the handling was badass untill i realised that the ride would get so crashy that my tyres would actually hop off the ground thus leaving me with 0 traction. F*ck that.

 

I still appreciate a naughty drop but with proper tyre sizes as that gives you some compliance as you say. I like looking at 'stanced' cars but would never have one. Thing is, what was regarded as good stance 2-3 years ago is now regarded as wack and jacked up lol.

 

Honestly though 195/40 are a horrible size tyre on 17's, they're not as bad on 16's though. Like I said go for 205/40. You'd be suprised, with rolled arches and spacers etc you can still get the car sitting nice.

Edited June 12, 2012 by Abdul

[mookie 0]

I just don't get the really low, huge wheel and rock hard suspension approach. If it is uncomfortable and doesn't handle any better (infact it will be alot worse with appalling cornering and less efficient braking) then why do it?

 

I bought the car that way. I didn't 'do' anything Merely asking for some opinions as I've never owned a car with wheels this big and tyres this small... however I have owned a number of cars on various methods of lowering so know what to expect in the other areas. I not after getting slated as I only asked a question, about a car I've owned only a few weeks and I am looking to improve rather than make impractical or a pain to drive - it's a daily and I drive it hard when I get the chance.

 

As for suspension travel, it has loads of it. As I said earlier my suspicion was the thin tyres were at fault, not the height of the car. I was just hoping to eliminate what I expected to be decent coilovers from the equation.

 

And this is not a 'low' car. It's certainly being 'lowered', but it's hardly what could be called stanced or slammed or decked or whatever the word would be. Aside from the deep splitter, not one part of the car touches speedbumps, curbs, anything in the road etc etc. The arches are not rolled, the arch liners are intact, and I have zero tyre/car interference. As I said earlier the coils are barely wound down, probably about 50% down, it's not like I'm riding on the bumpstops or bouncing down the road with wheels lifting off the tarmac because it's so stiff. You can get your fingers between the tyre and the unrolled arch very easily too...

 

I'm more likely to simply get a set of 16s with a larger profile rather than bigger tyres for the 17s as aesthetically it looks awful on big tyres and therefore inevitabley more arch gap. Afterall I bought a Corrado for it's handling, power and looks. I get the current thing for keeping them very OEM and going for a subtle drop... but I love Corrados when they sit nice in a different way to that. This whole arguement is very familiar to me from being in on the exact same discussions regarding Integra DC2's. The purists vs the modifiers.... but there's room for both I reckon.

Edited June 12, 2012 by mookie

[DriverVR6 11]

Mookie, my comment wasn't in anyway meant to slate you, and I know that you have only just bought the car, and it was like this when you bought it.

 

The car looks very good, but with the set up as it is at the moment it will not give a good ride or handle well. Handling and comfort is a compromise, but if you go too much either way then the car becomes unenjoyable and/or undriveable (Too soft and high and it will just roll and be pretty scary. Too hard and low and it's wheels will lose contact and adhesion with the road and be dangerous, and completely undriveable in the wet).

 

As some posters have said there is a section of car enthusiasts to whom how the car looks and it's stance is important, and there's nothing wrong with that. I'm more inclined to go for performance and function. The way I see it, a car looking good isn't going to keep it from skidding off into a hedge, or stop it from going into the back of the truck that just braked heavily infront.

 

This is just my opinion, but each to their own.

[mookie 0]

Yeah mate I know, wasn't meant to be having a go at you there. Sounds a bit harsh when I read it back...

 

Even with my Mk2 I never went to the sort of lengths others would, and end up with a car that was crashy or uncomfortable... or dangerous. You're right, there is a line between handling and comfort and the challenge is trying not to stray too far either side of it. I think my goal is to have a handsome looking Corrado, that sits nice, looks great to anyone (not just the experts), but I will enjoy driving too and not begrudge the way it rides because of the pursuit of 'lows'... I'd never pander to the scene-kids and their crumpled wheel arches and cracked paintwork on the wings just for that extra 5mm of drop - anything but that!

 

On the other hand, I think the Corrado can look very awkward without some adjustment to the ride height... but I'm quite reluctant to start messing with the arches, or put the sump in the line of fire either. Difficult balancing act.

 

I'd love to keep the 17s on, and I love how other Corrado's look on the RS 301s with similarly skinny tyres and in some cases even lower ride heights; but if it means the car drives like an absolute boneshaker, even on £7-800 coilovers, then I'll need to re-evaluated what I do wheel and tyre wise.

[bristolbaron 10]

it all depends on what you want to do to sort it.. comps still look good on a 205/40 and will bit a bit more forgiving for it, without causing any extra scrubbing etc.

 

a better option would be to drop down to 16's on 205/45's and raise the car 10-15mm - but i can understand why you wouldnt want to.

 

V1's will still be part of the cause though, mine are a lot firmer than the weitecs i've had on a couple of other rados.