Steering rack issues solutions and swaps....

[VRTrickster 0]

Is this SEAT rack adjustable though ?

[_leon_ 0]

just fitted a recon one from ECP this weekend - not an enjoyable or easy job - especially since I had the car on axle stands to do it. Bloody ball joints on the hub carrier were seized on like you would not believe... But, now the steering is fantastic - better than it has been since I owned the car. Garry wrote up a step by step guide to do it and I found it was pretty much accurate without following it. With the price of either a Seat or recon rack, its not that expensive to do and you'll be glad when you start driving it again with the difference.

 

Anyone unsure of how to go about doing it feel free to PM me with any questions.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

OK, we played about with the preload screw again on Tuesday. We wound it in to the point where we couldn't physically turn the wheels, and then backed it off again. It's been clonk free since and the steering is ultra tight and precise.

 

Word of caution though, the preload screw is senstive, as little as 1/4 turn too much will lock the steering solid, so be careful!

[s.g 0]

leon how much did the rack set you back???

[_leon_ 0]

160 exchange from ECP

[Andy T 0]

OK, we played about with the preload screw again on Tuesday. We wound it in to the point where we couldn't physically turn the wheels, and then backed it off again. It's been clonk free since and the steering is ultra tight and precise.

 

Word of caution though, the preload screw is senstive, as little as 1/4 turn too much will lock the steering solid, so be careful!

 

Yeah the adjustment screw only takes up the play at the straight ahead position, so winding it too tight can cause it to become tight on full or partial lock and loose the self centering - have to be very careful.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Yeah I forgot to mention it can remove the self centering too.....but in my case the Quaife artificially loads the steering with extra self centering anyway, but without one the steering could feel a bit weird if you wind it in too far!

[dr_mat 0]

We wait and see if it makes any long-term difference, because as we all know, VRs feel great on their way back from Stealth ... ;)

[N_TaG 0]

is there a pre-load screw on the 16v rack? Is the job of replacing the same procedure on a 16v as on a G60? My clunking is def getting worse and actually 'jerks' both the wheels visibly on the clunk. Also noticed that everyone now and then during turning the clunk is felt when i hit a bump.

[davidwort 0]

Just adding my 2p to the debate....

 

I fitted a steering rack out of a 02 Seat Cordoba to a mate's 16V corrado during the summer. The racks are almost identical externally and have the same ratio (going by number of turns lock to lock)

 

He had his old rack reconditioned 3 times (by 2 different companies) before that and it leaked within days each time. I think it lasted a week or so one of the times.

 

His old rack had 36 splines on the input shaft and the Seat one had 22 so I had to swap the lower UJ to a 22 spline one. But the Cordoba one is a different setup so I couldn't use that one but I found a suitable one in a 96 Toledo. The difference is where the UJ connects to the steering column, in the corrado it connects inside the car via another splined shaft but on the Cordoba the shaft splits in 2 with a pair of bolts.

 

Anyway the car has been fine since (as it should with a relatively new rack)

 

And best of all was that the secondhand rack and 22 spline Universal joint cost less than half of the cost of reconditioning his own.

 

Seems to me to be the best way out of the problem. I don't think that reconditioning old steering racks is a very good idea, I'll certainly never get one done again after Steve's experience during the summer and what Jay has said about his recently recon'd rack giving trouble has confirmed that it's not really worthwhile to me.

 

Geo, can I get this straight,

a Cordoba/Ibiza rack (any particular model/engine, how about polos?) will fit a 16v Corrado with an early (36 spline) rack from the factory. You then need a later Corrado 16v/G60 UJ with 22 splines to mate up to the Seat rack?

 

My rack is very worn in the straight ahead position, haven't tried adjusting the preload screw - even if it has one yet, but at 145,000 miles and 15 years old it's obviously past it's best.

 

I'm just trying to work out the best way forward as the rack and UJ/steering column are the only bits on the car that haven't been replaced yet.

 

cheers,

David.

[Geo 0]

Geo, can I get this straight,

a Cordoba/Ibiza rack (any particular model/engine, how about polos?) will fit a 16v Corrado with an early (36 spline) rack from the factory. You then need a later Corrado 16v/G60 UJ with 22 splines to mate up to the Seat rack?

 

That is exactly it. The model I got the rack out of was a 01 cordoba so any similar shape ibiza or cordoba should be the same. An old caddy van (96-04ish model) one will also work. Not sure on the polo ones think they could be different.

 

You then need a 22 spline UJ either from a later corrado or an old model seat toledo one will also work (93-99 shape, steering rack from this model toledo will also work incidentally) The cordoba UJ is different at the steering column end and won't work.

[davidwort 0]

That is exactly it. The model I got the rack out of was a 01 cordoba so any similar shape ibiza or cordoba should be the same. An old caddy van (96-04ish model) one will also work. Not sure on the polo ones think they could be different.

 

You then need a 22 spline UJ either from a later corrado or an old model seat toledo one will also work (93-99 shape, steering rack from this model toledo will also work incidentally) The cordoba UJ is different at the steering column end and won't work.

 

great cheers, I'll be on the lookout for a lowish mileage ibiza etc. rack then, looks like a UJ should be fairly easy to come by (think there's actually one on e-bay at the mo), would be great to bring the steering feel back up to scratch.

 

David.

[24V Renshaw 0]

Well in the interests of research I have just bought a brand new OE SEAT Ibiza rack off Ebay for £75. Looks indentical to the Rado one, so we shall see when it arrives.....

 

Will keep you all posted. :)

 

Jay

[Kevin Bacon 5]

We wait and see if it makes any long-term difference, because as we all know, VRs feel great on their way back from Stealth ... ;)

 

Yeah, I'm not banking on it being a permanent fix! What do Corrado owners and Golfers have in common? The pursuit of consistency!

[bcstudent 0]

Well in the interests of research I have just bought a brand new OE SEAT Ibiza rack off Ebay for £75. Looks indentical to the Rado one, so we shall see when it arrives.....

 

Will keep you all posted. :)

 

Jay

Is there a difference between the VR6 rack and, say, the 2.0 16v rack?

 

I'm interested to know exactly what goes on inside my 16v steering rack as replacing my PAS pump today hasn't cured the heavy steering when cold.

[24V Renshaw 0]

The only difference I can find so far is that some have the 22 point spline on the input shaft and others have more, but you can get the corresponding UJ to match them up anyway. Other than that they are the same. The Track-rods screw straight into both racks no probs.

 

Jay

[bcstudent 0]

That's bloody handy to know. So, what exactly is inside a VAG PAS rack and how do they work?

[24V Renshaw 0]

To put it very simply, not a lot.

Basically you have a "rack" Length of metal bar with teeth cut in it and a piston part way a long. A "pinion" gear which drives said rack and a clever little torque valve which when it "twists" because a big enough load is experienced (slow speed steering) opens up and allows hydraulic fluid under pressure to assist the rack by pushing the piston.

 

Jay

[davidwort 0]

The only difference I can find so far is that some have the 22 point spline on the input shaft and others have more, but you can get the corresponding UJ to match them up anyway. Other than that they are the same. The Track-rods screw straight into both racks no probs.

 

Jay

 

OK, I found an Ibiza rack this morning, but it's on a 25,000 mile 2002 car and the scrappy wants 100 quid (including removal from ibiza).

 

So that doesn't exactly seem a bargain, but as delivery won't cost me anything it seems close to what you paid.

 

Do you know if they're different on different SEATs? it's a 1.2 16v(so he reckons - never heard of that engine) seems odd this would have the same rack as a corrado, but all the ibiza sub-frames certainly look like the C one.

 

cheers, David.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Pooey pants, the clunk has returned....although the steering is still tight and slop free. Looks like Dr Mat was right, it must be something else causing it....and it burned me to say that, LOL! :-)

 

My money is on this also infamous '30 degree' ball joint issue. It seems that in the dead ahead, there is almost no detectable play in worn BJs, but turn the steering 30 degrees, and there's your slop..... I'll get Vince to check them out when I'm next there.

[dr_mat 0]

LOL, I can't believe I'm reading it.. :)

BJs: Yours are brand new, like mine! (Ok, you've done a fair few miles, but given that the symptoms didn't change when they were fitted, I don't think it's reasonable to assume it's them.)

I am beginning to (well, "continuing to") suspect subframe movement against the chassis. How would you replicate that on a ramp? No way it would "feel" loose.

[Kevin Bacon 5]

He he...thought you'd like that :-)

 

Well, my BJs are about 40,000 miles old now and like you I'd be surprised if they're knackered already! But you never know.

 

Vince suggested subframe movement too but we torqued the bolts up good and tight....dunno, it's a mystery. Despite the clunk it still drives superbly so I might just live with it....it's not like it does it every turn, just once or twice a day.

 

I'm beginning to suspect the UJ...maybe it only clunks with sufficient load on it? You've replaced the UJ haven't you?

[dr_mat 0]

No, didn't swap it. But again, it's been on+off the car a couple of times. I don't believe they could cause the symptoms I'm getting. (Could cause a clunk though - I'll agree there.)

Did you ever take a good look at the condition of all the arms on the hub assemblies? What about the wishbones?

My clunk really seems like something's moving, and it's exascerbated by the steering being on lock when the jolt comes through. The same road jolts with no steering lock doesn't seem to have the same result.

Whatever it is, I think you really have to hit it hard to make it move. I was coming down a multi-storey car park once and it clunked back "in" at the bottom of a ramp at 30 mph. That was quite a jolt..

[Kevin Bacon 5]

Haven't really looked at the wishbones or the hubs in any detail, they just look like rusted piles and straight enough....well, I did put an engineers 'straight edge' on the wishbones once and there was no runout, which is why I've never replaced them.

 

I might replace the hubs though (only about £50 a side) and bearings though as I'm fitting some 4 pots in March and they need to be dead central and square on the disc and I've read that the VR hubs are prone to distorting and wearing abnormally on the inside edge of where the bearing sits....or some such like.

 

This clunk only occurs when backing off the drive where the camber of the pavement's drop kerb is a bit severe and it happens at about 30 degrees lock. Either side of 30 degrees it's fine and won't do it again for the rest of the day. Strange!

[_leon_ 0]

i'm now getting a slight clunk from mine. only been last weekend I've had the new rack, rods and ends in. Can feel it through the column... When the cars stationary - if i turn the wheel enough to hear the pump come on - then let go of the wheel - theres a faint clunk or thud sound and it makes me think theres play there somewhere. haven't located it - but this weekend I'll be spending some time finding out where it is coming from. Keep me posted here too! I'll be checking!