20v Turbo Engine. Which one and what BHP?

[Flexso 0]

Hello all,

 

Im seriously considering going for the conversion. I'm at the starting block so have a question for all which may help others in the future.

 

Which 20vt engine is the best to start with and what would be its intial BHP?

 

If anyone can list the engines that would best a massive help.

 

Thanks

[marcocorrado 0]

Hello mate, I have just finished a project on a friends car using an AGU 1.8t engine which has the cable throttle and big port head. I think the AGU was an early engine so will probably always have higher mileage. They are 150bhp as standard, and from what i was told, so dont quote me, an easier engine to use if your going to use a qpeng DIY kit for the loom etc.

 

You will find plenty of help on here mate soo fire awayy with questions and you will always get an answer.

[swiftkid 1]

http://www.qpeng.com/faqs/engine_faqs/a ... _mean.html

 

hope that helps, the bam (late audi s3's and seat leon's) have the most power but are more expensive to get hold of for obvious reasons. im not exactly sure about fitting of the engines but there is a definitive 20v thread in the engine bay forum for guidance and help

[Flexso 0]

thank you for the answers so far. what about the skoda range. Are those engines compatible? Also Seat seem to have a few as stated above. Are the normal Cupra engine strong? any idea on the BHP?

[Flexso 0]

thank for the link as well swiftkid. Really helpful. Looks like there is alot to choose from.

[swiftkid 1]

the engines as far as i know are pretty good, don't go near them around the 90k mark from what i've heard, they need cam belts, water pumps, turbo's, rebuild etc about that age. to be honest i only know this as i was looking at buying an s3 and not doing an engine conversion so im sure there are more knowledgable people about.

 

i would hazard a guess they are all the same engine but different turbo, management and injection systems.

 

the normal cupra engines are 180bhp but it says that in the link i sent you.

[bananawhip 0]

Alright Mikey boy, kept this one quiet, fancy giving me a little run for my money do ya :D

 

Go for something with at least a ko3s turbo or better still a ko4, don't bother with a ko3 as you'll be starting with a handicap already..good luck with it bro'

[davidwort 0]

there's quite a large range of 1.8T engines for different car and model years, but IIRC it goes something like this:

early (passat) non DBW (drive by wire) 150bhp (AGU?) and early audi A4/A6

early mk4 golfs (150)

later mk4's, leons, octavias, A4/A6/TT with DBW 150bhp

late golfs/leons/octavia/TT VRS 150/180 (same DBW engine and turbo but different VW mapping)

then the bigger power 210-225 bhp leon cupra R, Audi S3, TT

 

A late 150 1.8T can be happily mapped to IRO 195bhp (REVO etc) and about the same for 180 engines

earlier cars can't be mapped quite as high

 

210-225 engines are stronger and come with bigger turbos etc as standard, so with just a remap can go well above 250.

[Flexso 0]

Ha ha ha. Hello Tom. Yeah im looking into a engine conversion. My car car is leaking so much oil, its like i left the sump on a speed bump smoewhere in middlesex.

 

Thanks for the knowledge david. Im quite new to the idea, so when you DBW, this is the throttle opening and closing electronically instead of using a throttle cable? (like on my car at the mo)

[Kevin Bacon 5]

IMHO, if you're planning on 300+ hp further down the line, none of the 1.8T engines will achieve that - reliably - without rods and pistons, bigger turbos and manifolds and mapping. So basically you can pick any engine.

 

This "AGU + 225 block" is a bit of a myth. All the biggest power 1.8Ts I've seen are late small port engines.

 

If you want a very nice, OEM smooth and reliable install and happy to stick to around 230hp with all standard parts, then I recommend the BJX engine from the 06 -> Current Polo GTI. It's quite a rare car though, so might be tricky to find one in a breaker's.

 

VW addressed a few shortcomings with this engine and imo, it has by far the best mapping of all the 1.8Ts. It has the newest ME7 ECU and you can do a lot with it.

 

I would also recommend using the factory management and not a standalone unless you're aiming for over 350hp.

 

Another option is the 2.0 TFSI from the MK5 GTI. Golfs are everywhere, so plentiful supply of engines. That is a better engine than the 1.8T imo. 400hp capable without internal mods.

[Leonard 0]

The new Golf Edition 30 or S3 engine would be nice :norty:

 

Probably more expensive initial purchase over an old 1.8T but an easy and very cheap 300bhp 8)

[Flexso 0]

thanks for the replies. the 230 BHP is where im looking max. Just looking for a really good replacement engine with a bit more grunt. The car is an everyday user aswell so want it to be reliable as pos.

 

Do you guys think that for that sort of output S3, TT, or cupra R engines are gonna be best. Would I be scretching a golf gti engine to get that output?

 

Also which is the easier install DBW or something like Qpeng?

[rado-steve 0]

thanks for the replies. the 230 BHP is where im looking max. Just looking for a really good replacement engine with a bit more grunt. The car is an everyday user aswell so want it to be reliable as pos.

 

Do you guys think that for that sort of output S3, TT, or cupra R engines are gonna be best. Would I be scretching a golf gti engine to get that output?

 

Also which is the easier install DBW or something like Qpeng?

 

Mines an AUQ KO3s Motor,came from an Octy vRS! I agree with most peeps that if you want a good reliable motor to use everyday then find a KO3s! Mine is std but with a decent FMIC, Zorst and Filter is good for 195bhp on Awesomes Rollers! Mapped up it should be good for 240ish :) A mapped 225 motor should give you roughly 280bhp but you're looking at a £500-£1000 price difference over a KO3s Motor!!

 

I paid a grand for my motor complete with all ancillieries, wiring harness, ecu and Gearbox, that was over 2 years ago, sure they will be cheaper now!!

 

It's running Full VW Management and the DBW, Std Corrado clocks so it all looks very factory! In 2 years I have had no probs with it at all, it is a quick reliable car and it sounds Awesome on full boost :)

 

I can give you the contact number for the guy who did the Harness on mine, he is very clued up and will charge 1/2 what qpeng is!!!

 

As Kev says go for the latest Engine you can afford, but make sure you get everything you need from the one car! Mixing and matching can lead to a few odd problems :shrug:

[Kevin Bacon 5]

The newest ECUs don't need much in the way of wiring, so long as you get everything as Steve says! The only issue is the CAN Bus signal the newest ECUs use to feed the rev counter in the original clocks, but that's work-aroundable.

 

The K03S is nice as it is, but for little money you can get a K04-001 which is the only true bolt on replacement for a K03S. The K04-023 from the TT etc isn't a direct bolt on. The K04-001 is good for ~ 265-270 but the beauty is it spools just as fast as the K03S, and it holds the boost to the redline.

It's a brilliant upgrade!

 

All you need to accompany it is a TT 3" MAF, TT 363cc injectors and you're off. A remap would reap better rewards though, but it's all bolt-onable!

 

Not that it's obvious, but I've been researching all this as I'm hoping to convince the missus her Polo needs the K04-001 + 2.5" exhaust upgrade :D

[rado-steve 0]

The newest ECUs don't need much in the way of wiring, so long as you get everything as Steve says! The only issue is the CAN Bus signal the newest ECUs use to feed the rev counter in the original clocks, but that's work-aroundable.

 

The K03S is nice as it is, but for little money you can get a K04-001 which is the only true bolt on replacement for a K03S. The K04-023 from the TT etc isn't a direct bolt on. The K04-001 is good for ~ 265-270 but the beauty is it spools just as fast as the K03S, and it holds the boost to the redline.

It's a brilliant upgrade!

 

All you need to accompany it is a TT 3" MAF, TT 363cc injectors and you're off. A remap would reap better rewards though, but it's all bolt-onable!

 

Not that it's obvious, but I've been researching all this as I'm hoping to convince the missus her Polo needs the K04-001 + 2.5" exhaust upgrade :D

 

Jabba Sport sell the Rev Counter Converters, thats where mine came from, think it was about £40!

 

Where can you get the KO4-001 Turbos from or are they a KO3s/K04 Hybrid??? Do the have the same fitment as the KO3s?? If so It would save me having to change the Manifold and downpipe on mine :clap: I already have the MAF, injectors etc! I have a KO4 but it is from a TT!!!

 

Anymore info would be sweet :)

[Flexso 0]

im afraid gents that this conversion will have to be done on a small budget, so maybe ko3s engine might be the right choice.

 

Do you think that the DBW option will the better of the two options if doing it on budget? What extra items would i need over the items they list on the Qpeng site to run DBW?

[junkie 0]

On a remapped K03s you will achieve pretty much your target BHP and in a 1500kg TT its rapid even driving the 4 wheels when it does and i bet it would give my car a run for its money very easily so in the slightly lighter Corrado shell it will be awesome.

 

When they are mapped as well i think [and i cant remember exactly which one it is] but the DBW or the VVT will map slightly higher on a stock engine so it just means a few extra goodies bolted on to achieve your target power if you get one without, but it is alot easier to install the non DBW.

[rado-steve 0]

im afraid gents that this conversion will have to be done on a small budget, so maybe ko3s engine might be the right choice.

 

Do you think that the DBW option will the better of the two options if doing it on budget? What extra items would i need over the items they list on the Qpeng site to run DBW?

 

Well using the DBW throttle, you'll need to fabricate a bracket for the pedal and get it welded into the footwell! You can use the 1.8T 'box too, just change the output flanges!

 

The q-peng Downpipes are quite good for the money and it would prob cost more to get somebody to fabricate one for you!!!

[dragon green 4]

spoke to TSR and they use the engines from "vans" bigger turbos,and easier to tune !

anyone shed anymore light on the subject ?

[Flexso 0]

The easier route to go would be something like Qpeng. But DBW is the cheaper of the options?

[rado-steve 0]

Don't think you can get a 180bhp engine with a cable throttle! Like I said I can put you in contact with the guy that did the loom for mine, he'll be a hell of a lot cheaper than q-peng! Plus you'll be able to run VAG-Com aswell! Don't think q-peng has the ability to run the VVT on the later engines either!

[Cnut 0]

Didn't they do an Audi TT quattro Sport with 240 bhp on the 20v Turbo engine too?

[junkie 0]

They did do a Quattro Sport but its just the map thats different to the 225 to give a slight increase to justify the "special edition" tag along with a slight weight reduction, pole position seats and a different set of wheels and black roof.

[Abdul 0]

What car is a K04-001 from Kev?? Can anyone shed any light on how low the sump on the 1.8T sits once in the rado compared to a valver/vr?? I know they're funkin low on tt's.

[Neil VR6 0]

My mates selling his big port (and forged rods I think) 20V lump. pm me if you'd like his contact details :)